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Yes….indeed!
Now to the Great Supper!! Another rebuke to the priesthood and religious ‘authorities’………….
6. PARABLE OF THE GREAT SUPPER
A. TIME: A.D. 30
B. PLACE: Philadelphia
C. OCCASION: This parable was called forth by a lawyer at the breakfast given by a Pharisee, and at the conclusion of Jesus’ speech.
D. REFERENCES: (1835.1) 167:2.1 (Luke 14:15-24)
E. THE PARABLE: “As Jesus finished speaking at the breakfast table of the Pharisee, one of the lawyers present, desiring to relieve the silence, thoughtlessly said: ‘Blessed is he who shall eat bread in the kingdom of God’—that being a common saying of those days. And then Jesus spoke a parable, which even his friendly host was compelled to take to heart. He said:
“‘A certain ruler gave a great supper, and having bidden many guests, he dispatched his servants at suppertime to say to those who were invited, “Come, for everything is now ready.” And they all with one accord began to make excuses. The first said, “I have just bought a farm, and I must needs to go prove it; I pray you have me excused.” Another said, “I have bought five yoke of oxen, and I must go to receive them; I pray you have me excused.” And another said, “I have just married a wife, and therefore I cannot come.” So the servants went back and reported this to their master. When the master of the house heard this, he was very angry, and turning to his servants, he said: “I have made ready this marriage feast; the fatlings are killed, and all is in readiness for my guests, but they have spurned my invitation; they have gone every man after his lands and his merchandise, and they even show disrespect to my servants who bid them come to my feast. Go out quickly, therefore, into the streets and lanes of the city, out into the highways and the byways, and bring hither the poor and the outcast, the blind and the lame, that the marriage feast may have guests.” And the servants did as their lord commanded, and even then there was room for more guests. Then said the lord to his servants: “Go now out into the roads and the countryside and constrain those who are there to come in that my house may be filled. I declare that none of those who were first bidden shall taste of my supper.” And the servants did as their master commanded, and the house was filled.’”(1693.2) “There was a certain rich man named Dives, who, being clothed in purple and fine linen, lived in mirth and splendor every day. And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, who was laid at this rich man’s gate, covered with sores and desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man’s table; yes, even the dogs came and licked his sores. And it came to pass that the beggar died and was carried away by the angels to rest in Abraham’s bosom. And then, presently, this rich man also died and was buried with great pomp and regal splendor. When the rich man departed from this world, he waked up in Hades, and finding himself in torment, he lifted up his eyes and beheld Abraham afar off and Lazarus in his bosom. And then Dives cried aloud: ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me and send over Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water to cool my tongue, for I am in great anguish because of my punishment.’ And then Abraham replied: ‘My son, you should remember that in your lifetime you enjoyed the good things while Lazarus in like manner suffered the evil. But now all this is changed, seeing that Lazarus is comforted while you are tormented. And besides, between us and you there is a great gulf so that we cannot go to you, neither can you come over to us.’ Then said Dives to Abraham: ‘I pray you send Lazarus back to my father’s house, inasmuch as I have five brothers, that he may so testify as to prevent my brothers from coming to this place of torment.’ But Abraham said: ‘My son, they have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.’ And then answered Dives: ‘No, No, Father Abraham! but if one go to them from the dead, they will repent.’ And then said Abraham: ‘If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded even if one were to rise from the dead.'”(169:3.3) After Peter had recited this ancient parable of the Nazarite brotherhood, and since the crowd had quieted down, Andrew arose and dismissed them for the night. Although both the apostles and his disciples frequently asked Jesus questions about the parable of Dives and Lazarus, he never consented to make comment thereon.Why was this parable included in the Urantia Book if it was “not according to the gospel we preach” as Simon Peter said before he recited it?I think the reason Jesus “never consented to make comment thereon” is because the message is natural and obvious.Could it be, like Abraham said in the parable “If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded even if one were to rise from the dead” like Jesus did, then the refusal to “hear” will lead to ending up not surviving because “there is a great gulf so that we cannot go to you?”What is the meaning of the parable?Could it be that the “great gulf” that’s created by the unwillingness to “hear” what is “told” leads to the inability to go where Lazarus went, because of the purpose of the potential of imperfect free will and mortality?What are your thoughts?When the rich man departed from this world, he waked up in Hades, and finding himself in torment . . .
Jesus taught that God neither favors nor torments people. And there’s no such place as Hades, making this parable a questionable teaching tool. The reason it is included is to contrast the difference between Jesus’ parables and human parables. Humans and their creative imagination so often get truth muddled beyond recognition.
When the rich man departed from this world, he waked up in Hades, and finding himself in torment . . .
Jesus taught that God neither favors or torments people. And there’s no such place as Hades, making this parable a questionable teaching tool.
Yeah, that’s how I thought about it too. Which always made me wonder why it was included in the text.
What stands out for me, and I’ll give you that I’m probably going too far with it, is that the point of the parable is to emphasize the importance of getting it right.
‘My son, they have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.’
I wonder if all this might be a lot more exact than I want to admit. That the purpose of mortality is to act as a stop gap. A way to separate the tares from the wheat rather automatically, based on a desire to be willing to even “hear” in the first place, let alone learning how to do what has been “listened” to.
I guess what I’m trying to say is that if there isn’t willingness to “hear” how can you listen?
I guess what I’m trying to say is that if there isn’t willingness to “hear” how can you listen?
That’s the best Van/nodism I’ve seen so far. I really like it! I’ve said over a zillion times that willingness is critical. The willingness to cooperate is really all you need besides faith. And sometimes I think they’re tied up together somehow.
26:4.15 Willingness to believe is the key to Havona.
26:4.15Willingness to believe is the key to Havona.Well there you go then. Thanks for digging that up. So if that’s true for Havona, wouldn’t it be true for M1 too? Is that the message of the parable of Dives? That if you aren’t willing to believe, you won’t be “hearing” anything. Which will make it impossible to be on the right side of the “great gulf” and at the same time, justify the purpose of mortality to weed out those who don’t want eternal life, according to their free wiil, and aren’t willing to believe because “there’s no evidence” or whatever right off the bat, effecting the first great divide through natural mortality.(I’ve been talking with way too many atheists lately)Is that the message of the parable of Dives?
I think the message is – God is no respecter of persons. In a nutshell:
In terms of the universe view of things, there are only two kinds of persons: those who know God and those who don’t (133:0.3). God loves them both, but those who know him are happier.
Here’s another willingness quote worth mentioning:
34:6.11 Every step you take must be one of willingness, intelligent and cheerful co-operation.
It’s not just any old willingness. It’s cheerful and intelligent willingness. I have trouble with the cheerful part.
I have been thinking about this idea. How to do?
From the Internet find: http://peopleof.oureverydaylife.com/write-parable-6514.html
Anyone ever try to author a parable?
Mara did.
Anyone ever try to author a parable?
Mara did.
i missed it
and didn’t Jesus give instructions to apostles about parable design?
When the rich man departed from this world, he waked up in Hades, and finding himself in torment . . .
Jesus taught that God neither favors or torments people. And there’s no such place as Hades, making this parable a questionable teaching tool.
Yeah, that’s how I thought about it too. Which always made me wonder why it was included in the text. What stands out for me, and I’ll give you that I’m probably going too far with it, is that the point of the parable is to emphasize the importance of getting it right.
‘My son, they have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.’
I wonder if all this might be a lot more exact than I want to admit. That the purpose of mortality is to act as a stop gap. A way to separate the tares from the wheat rather automatically, based on a desire to be willing to even “hear” in the first place, let alone learning how to do what has been “listened” to. I guess what I’m trying to say is that if there isn’t willingness to “hear” how can you listen?
Greetings Enno!! So I see what you’re saying about the mortality “stop gap” but my take on the wheat and tares is a little different and not at all certain…speculation and creative reading only. = ) I wonder if the wheat and tares do not represent people at all? Perhaps the wheat is the harvest of all the good seeds planted in our mortal life that reside in soul and circle progress while the tares are the errors, evil, and sin that grew up alongside the truth, beauty, and goodness experienced and expressed?
In such a manner does the wheat arrive on M1 but the tares are left behind or destroyed by their irrelevance and unreality? Is this not the way of it as described in the UB? We may arrive with “vestiges” of our mortal/animal natures but we do not arrive under the burden of all the tares we grew during our mortal lives? We should remember that there is no need for the Mansion Worlds when the mortal soul fuses with the Adjuster on the world of birth….Mansion Worlds are remedial education and experience centers for all those who have tares in their wheat field upon mortality….there remains more wheat still to grow prior to fusion itself.
I think the older parable on Dives is not so much about those who do not listen or hear during mortality then will not listen in Heaven so much as, related to the feeding of the 5000, those who will not believe without seeing in the mortal life are also unlikely to be moved to hear much by visitations, signs, wonders, or miracles either….even if a ghost appeared from the grave. Abraham is pointing out that none should need signs, wonders, and miracles to believe and find faith for all are endowed with the dual nature, the Spirit within, the love/reality response, and the fruits of the Spirit. If that’s not enough for a mortal to hear, listen, learn, and live by….then it is unlikely anything wondrous move them…..but always is there hope for such response in any and all minds….and then there are the remedial spheres of Mansonia for those who give birth to soul but do not add much to assist it’s growth once so born.
There are many with a flicker whose light remains dim…but not extinguished by that fully cognizant and final rejection. We must grow our inner light strong and steady to fuse remember…..but a flicker will see us to the other side for further education. Going back to the wheat and tares again, consider that some fields have far more wheat than tares, while some fields have lots of tares amongst the wheat and some fields are 50/50….and some, well it appears there are more tares than wheat….and yet, there is still wheat for the harvest to come!
And this is why I agree with Bonita about the older parable being a poor Gospel lesson…..no hell, no damnation, no eternal suffering exist for any nor for any reason. Jesus did embrace the ‘kingdom’ although inferior to the ‘family’ and attempted to link the two but you cannot teach about hell and suffering when that is just primitive beliefs from the days of ghost fear and appeasement!
Just a few thoughts my reading here brings to mind!
I understand what you’re saying Bradly. I have to admit I’m anything but sure about what I’ve been thinking, what Dives’ parable means and why it was included in the text as a btw.
I’m wondering though, you often add to the discussions, the reality of how we’re engaged in transferring the seat of our identities from the material to the morontial. These experiences are spiritual in nature and are the result of the willingness and desire to listen to what can be heard, if one so chooses, in order to grow Godward.
But when there isn’t an interest in listening, then that’s what becomes identified. To be unwilling.
What I wonder is, if such an unspiritual identification is even possible of transformation. If not, then returning to life over there probably won’t change much.
I hope I’m wrong. I have kids.
I have faith in all flickers.
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