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I’ve been hearing some talk how they don’t believe in God. He doesn’t exist.
Others who are talking with them tell them that God is there and that he’s close by.
They say it’s all for nothing, there’s no purpose it’s meaningless.
While their brothers and sisters who hear them standing by ask why?
They tell them to shut up they ask too many questions.
So it hurts to know the answers are waiting in reach nearby.
We here in this community do more than is believed.
And that for them is certainly oh just so very weird.
It makes me pause and wonder, why it’s so very hard for them to go.
To where is found that comfort, at home with love and joy.
Of all the perplexing problems growing out of the Lucifer rebellion, none has occasioned more difficulty than the failure of immature evolutionary mortals to distinguish between true and false liberty.
Immature = childlike, how Jesus referred to us.
but yes, yes, yes, I know who those people are, I read the Urantia book so it aint me.
its been festering for over 200k years and only I understand the difference between true and false liberty.😊
p435:4 39:4.11 What is loyalty? It is the fruit of an intelligent appreciation of universe brotherhood; one could not take so much and give nothing. As you ascend the personality scale, first you learn to be loyal, then to love, then to be filial, and then may you be free; but not until you are a finaliter, not until you have attained perfection of loyalty, can you self-realize finality of liberty.
Freedom begins with loyalty. What is loyalty? It is a wholehearted devotion to highest duty (3:5.12). What is our highest duty? To become God-like, to strive for perfection of divinity (1:0.4), which requires loving service to the universal brotherhood (that means everyone). You can’t be free, you are not permitted to enjoy personal liberty, unless you serve.
That’s the way the universe works. If you keep butting up against frustrating restraints, it’s either because you’re not playing by the rules or because you’re not mature enough to be allowed out of your playpen.
I make distinction between free and liberty. Free more defines what we are free of, like laws etc where liberty is more of a spiritual word. And just because it is spiritual don’t mean it is right. Think about this:
“True liberty is the quest of the ages and the reward of evolutionary progress. False liberty is the subtle deception of the error of time and the evil of space. Enduring liberty is predicated on the reality of justice—intelligence, maturity, fraternity, and equity”
Anyone want to take a stab at the evil of space or the error of time subtle deceptions?
Hi Midi – I agree wholeheartedly that (primary) Lanonandeks can teach their elder brothers MUCH about how best to nurture human cultures; that’s not the issue.
As I’m sure you can appreciate, all of Michael’s family (especially his elder Melchizedek and Vorondadek sons) understand that Nebadon EXISTS to allow the personalization of Adjusters by the human technique. But Lucifer convinced himself that Adjusters are not real; how can you have fragments of a non-existent Father?
In this sense, the fragility of Lucifer begins with delusion, not corruption.
Nigel
And just because it is spiritual don’t mean it is right.
What the heck are you talking about?
Gene asked: “Anyone want to take a stab at the evil of space or the error of time subtle deceptions?“
(613.4, 54:1.2) “True liberty is the quest of the ages and the reward of evolutionary progress. False liberty is the subtle deception of the error of time and the evil of space.”
Trinity Teacher Sons seem like the sort of guys to clarify such concepts:
(215.1, 19:1.4) “In this connection, however, it may be noted that Teacher Sons are the supreme co-ordinating personalities of Trinity origin. In such a far-flung universe of universes there is always great danger of succumbing to the error of the circumscribed viewpoint, to the evil inherent in a segmentalized conception of reality and divinity.”
Maybe “the evil of space” implies this “evil inherent in segmentalized (local) conceptions”?
Likewise, “the error of time” may simply imply the inevitable error of a circumscribed (time-dependent) viewpoint?
Both of these insufficiencies (inherent in any finite perspective) seem to apply to the “circumscribed viewpoint” and the “segmentalized conceptions” of Lucifer. In fact, weren’t these precisely his problems?
Nigel
And just because it is spiritual don’t mean it is right.
What the heck are you talking about?
lucifer is the example I had in mind. Evil and subtle deceptions we will be faced with beyond our Urania tenure.
Gene wrote:
“lucifer is the example I had in mind. Evil and subtle deceptions we will be faced with beyond our Urania tenure.”
Hi Gene – indeed! See my reply just above.
Nigel
Gene asked: “Anyone want to take a stab at the evil of space or the error of time subtle deceptions?“
(613.4, 54:1.2) “True liberty is the quest of the ages and the reward of evolutionary progress. False liberty is the subtle deception of the error of time and the evil of space.” Trinity Teacher Sons seem like the sort of guys to clarify such concepts:
(215.1, 19:1.4) “In this connection, however, it may be noted that Teacher Sons are the supreme co-ordinating personalities of Trinity origin. In such a far-flung universe of universes there is always great danger of succumbing to the error of the circumscribed viewpoint, to the evil inherent in a segmentalized conception of reality and divinity.” Maybe “the evil of space” implies this “evil inherent in segmentalized (local) conceptions”? Likewise, “the error of time” may simply imply the inevitable error of a circumscribed (time-dependent) viewpoint? Both of these insufficiencies (inherent in any finite perspective) seem to apply to the “circumscribed viewpoint” and the “segmentalized conceptions” of Lucifer. In fact, weren’t these precisely his problems? Nigel
Thx Nigel. Great quotes.
one thing is certain, we need to really understand the 5th revelation as I believe that the path to true liberty is laid out for us in it. And a Teacher Son perspective is most welcome.
Does the error of time and evil of space statements suggest that these challenges only exist in a finite universe? And any and all beings functioning in it are susceptible to being distracted by them?
Does the error of time and evil of space statements suggest that these challenges only exist in a finite universe? And any and all beings functioning in it are susceptible to being distracted by them?
Does this help?
111:6.3 The problem of sin is not self-existent in the finite world. The fact of finiteness is not evil or sinful. The finite world was made by an infinite Creator — it is the handiwork of his divine Sons — and therefore it must be good. It is the misuse, distortion, and perversion of the finite that gives origin to evil and sin.
Nebadon EXISTS to allow the personalization of Adjusters by the human technique. But Lucifer convinced himself that Adjusters are not real; how can you have fragments of a non-existent Father?
Nigel: I think that you may be putting the cart before the horse, with your implication that Lucifer was convinced that “Adjusters are not real;”, and one must keep in mind the time-line, and what we may understand as to the teachings being presented, in this case, on Urantia prior to the outbreak of rebellion. First, the reception of an automatic Thought Adjuster, was not until the time of Pentecost, therefore not everyone had an Adjuster. It is not mentioned as to whether Lucifer and his minions had a Thought Adjuster. We also know from the UB that prior to Pentecost there was a method in acquiring a Thought Adjuster. Also, we also know that the residents of Urantia were being taught about an “unseen Father” even to the point of having a temple dedicated in that name. Also, note that it mentions “unseen” not “Spiritual” and this would imply that being unseen, that the Father could be seen, in reality or physically, as would be interpreted by mortal residents. This same analogy could be likened to the Jewish temple having an area that housed the Ark of the Covenant that represented God to the Jew, yet considered as Spirit, not unseen, as might be implied or understood by followers, yet some were lead to believe the Priest in the Synagogue, where God’s representatives, needing to be followed. We know what Jesus spoke of these persons, same type of analogy, can be made. There is no mention that what was being taught prior to rebellion even mentioned Thought Adjusters which would have been a personal understanding by an individual, and how they might even acquire a Thought Adjuster. So, it can also be assumed that Lucifer was aware of Thought Adjusters but in his accusations it could not be assumed he was in reference to a Thought Adjuster, only that the residents and others were required to swear allegiance to an unseen God, as described by the teaching of that day. Also, if you are correct and the reference was to the Thought Adjuster, how can one swear allegiance to an entity located within oneself?
Had the teaching indicated “Spiritual Father” rather than “unseen Father” it might have directed the focus, by the students, away from their teachers, as representing something unseen as seen, therefore associating physical beings to the representatives of a God, similar to worshiping ideals.
Does the error of time and evil of space statements suggest that these challenges only exist in a finite universe? And any and all beings functioning in it are susceptible to being distracted by them?
Does this help?
111:6.3 The problem of sin is not self-existent in the finite world. The fact of finiteness is not evil or sinful. The finite world was made by an infinite Creator — it is the handiwork of his divine Sons — and therefore it must be good. It is the misuse, distortion, and perversion of the finite that gives origin to evil and sin.
yup!
Only mortal born ascenders have TA’s – not descending Sons. The Son’s Spirit had already been released on many worlds in the System (at least 606 mortal worlds with TA’s in the System) although many mortals born on Urantia had also received them prior to Pentecost – including the first two humans, Andon and Fonta. And the System had many, many finaliters in local service. So, TA’s are not and were not “hypothetical” anymore than the Supreme was/is.
53:3.6 (604.1) 3. The attack upon the universal plan of ascendant mortal training. Lucifer maintained that far too much time and energy were expended upon the scheme of so thoroughly training ascending mortals in the principles of universe administration, principles which he alleged were unethical and unsound. He protested against the agelong program for preparing the mortals of space for some unknown destiny and pointed to the presence of the finaliter corps on Jerusem as proof that these mortals had spent ages of preparation for some destiny of pure fiction. With derision he pointed out that the finaliters had encountered a destiny no more glorious than to be returned to humble spheres similar to those of their origin. He intimated that they had been debauched by overmuch discipline and prolonged training, and that they were in reality traitors to their mortal fellows since they were now co-operating with the scheme of enslaving all creation to the fictions of a mythical eternal destiny for ascending mortals. He advocated that ascenders should enjoy the liberty of individual self-determination. He challenged and condemned the entire plan of mortal ascension as sponsored by the Paradise Sons of God and supported by the Infinite Spirit.
It should be noted that not a single TA fused ascender was lost to rebellion:
53:7.10 (608.6) The ascending mortals were vulnerable, but they withstood the sophistries of rebellion better than the lower spirits. While many on the lower mansion worlds, those who had not attained final fusion with their Adjusters, fell, it is recorded to the glory of the wisdom of the ascension scheme that not a single member of the Satania ascendant citizenship resident on Jerusem participated in the Lucifer rebellion.
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