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Mara wrote: The big wars of the 20th Century. The current problems of religio-political extremism in the 21th Century – a different kind of big war.
So just what type of revolution occurred with the two world wars? (And incidentally, I think the current crisis with terroristic extremists is yet another world war.) What is it that was revolted against that made them epochal? And, can we claim any success? I’m not challenging you, in case you’re thinking that. I just think it’s a worthwhile discussion.
Personally, if it were possible I would like to ask the WW ll vets that never came home, in hind sight – if they think their efforts were worth it. sorry to drift a bit here but cant help it.
nelsong wrote: Personally, if it were possible I would like to ask the WW ll vets that never came home, in hind sight – if they think their efforts were worth it.The ones I know thought it was. They’re all passed on now, of course. No one wanted to see racial genocide and no one wanted the U.S. to become part of the German Reich or the Japanese Empire. For one person to have supreme control over others is something that should only belong to Deity; and they don’t even go there, giving absolute sovereignty to free will.
americans are not like that today
Oh I most wholeheartedly disagree. Remember post 9-11? Americans come together when their sovereignty is threatened. Those who think otherwise today are generally the mollycoddled youth and elitist intellectuals who think they are above it all. I can assure you that if there was any danger of the U.S. becoming part of the Ummah, very few would just sit back and allow it to happen.
Bonita wrote: What is it that was revolted against that made them epochal?I think it is a matter of scale – the attempt to influence the world to side with a revolutionary viewpoint/s in total disregard for the slow moving course of planetary evolution.Conclusion: The concept of liberty should not be exposed to half-evolved primitive men of any day/era for fear of the inevitable epochical revolution?
I wouldn’t draw that conclusion. Personhood and free will are gifts to each and every one of us. But people who try to hurry things up or those who try to hijack the evolutionary process are not going to succeed – in my opinion. Our history is strewn with failed attempts – large scale and small scale. But the seventh adjutant mind-spirit, the spirit of wisdom, is undiminished and ever-present (and unrecognized) on our world today. 36:5:12And then the Spirit of Truth is meant to lessen self-assertiveness – a cause of wars.194:3:18 Pentecost was designed to lessen the self-assertiveness of individuals, groups, nations, and races. It is this spirit of self-assertiveness which so increases in tension that it periodically breaks loose in destructive wars. Mankind can be unified only by the spiritual approach, and the Spirit of Truth is a world influence which is universal.
As a veteran I can assure you that I would take a stand to defend – I have the scars to prove itbut our borders are open and friend and foe alike are migrating here constantly without restraint.
an honest Paris resident (where this is happening) that has been around for long enough may admit that occupation by Germany is preferable to occupation by islam – I hope Americans are stronger than that but I wonder.
look at my home country Sweden – it is no longer Swedish. Liberalized, slow to arousal kind hearted Swedes just let go too long and discovered their rich heritage has been taken away.
Same degeneration happening here.
In an amaginary retrospective way I would prefer to speak German to Islamic. But I’ll perish before having to make a choice like that
nelsong,
My heartfelt thanks you for your service to our/your country!! And for all Vets past and present who go out and take a stand to defend.
Mara wrote: I think it is a matter of scale – the attempt to influence the world to side with a revolutionary viewpoint/s in total disregard for the slow moving course of planetary evolution.I was thinking more on what is suggested in Paper 134 concerning the Master’s teaching on political sovereignty which the author restates in order to apply to the, ” . . . peculiarly critical stage of the evolution of political sovereignty in the twentieth century after Christ.” (134:5.1)
Mara, what compelled you to start this thread. It is as if it were a tee off for me to say the following.
We have been living in the era of the ‘prodigal son’ and the son returned when the rebellion ended upon Michael’s last bestowal here on Urantia.
The era to follow is the the story of the eldest son. This is the story of what becomes of the eldest son who cannot understand the feast for the erring and sinful younger brother. The father pleads with him to join the celebration for the brother that was once lost and now has returned and repented. The parable leaves this story as a cliffhanger.
What will Gabriel do and how far will he go in Gabriel vs Lucifer? The Urantia Book begins this new era as this is the planet that is the focal point of a Universe’s destiny. This planet is a shrine to the meaning of the prodigal son and a Fathers Love.
Addendum: “Father, forgive them (Gabriel et al) for they know not what they are doing (Gabriel vs Lucifer).”
Mara, what compelled you to start this thread. It is as if it were a tee off for me to say . . . .I apologize for being too dense to get your tee off.
When I read Carolyn Kendall’s article, I began to ponder the interpretation of what is the era immediately to follow the conclusion of the present ideological struggle. It’s about the Book. It’s about where we are now. I began to ponder what is the present ideological struggle that we have to get past? How will we know, if we can know, when the present ideological struggle has concluded. I thought it was worth thinking about. They tell us, “. . .it is for this better order of affairs on earth that the book has been made ready.”No Mara, it was I who was too dense to see. I did not fully realize that this thread was so important. It was revealed to me this afternoon shortly after awaking from a nap.
We are truly on the brink of something wonderful. It is time to celebrate the return of our prodigal brothers. This is the joy of the Father. Yes, there are some who will never return for theirs is the fate of spiritual suicide. Satan has truly made himself unreal. Jesus could not bear to look upon him. But the fatted calf is on the BBQ, for there are those that were lost and are found.
What remains to complete the Father’s joy is to see the eldest son come join the feast and forgive the erring brothers as has Michael and Father. The ego is a mill stone around ones neck. We await Gabriel and those who feel as he does about their brothers that fell into sin to join the party. TUB is a segue to the celebration. It is the bridge to redemption and forgiveness and recovery. And Urantia is host of this celebration. Lets be good hosts. We live on the world of the cross.
The Urantia Book has a great and powerful purpose. Its purpose is to separate the wheat from the chaff. It is the last great temptation. It is the temptation of knowledge. It is the temptation of the knowledge of good and evil.
The rebellion has been over for nearly two thousand years and yet there are some who would not have it end. TUB provides the next era with the necessary propaganda that will continue to temp persons to take sides. Satan pleaded with Jesus to take sides and Jesus refused, only saying that God’s will be done. Jesus taught to not resist evil. He well knew that Father did not create evil or sin. There is no taking sides between reality and unreality. What Jesus went through we must all go through. That is the necessary segue bridge over to forgiveness.
I will not submit myself to this choosing. I am too quick to take that test. I refuse to be tempted. I refuse to take sides.
The Urantia Book is the temptation of knowledge and the weak would make an idol of it. It would abrogate the Spirit of Truth and the TA and the spirits of the Spirit. It is the crutch of the idolator.
Only three authors of the book have experience with fusion with their TA. The Mighty Messenger is rebellion tested and has chosen sides. The other two are One without Name and Number and One High in Authority, both having much to do with justice in the Superuniverse. They also have chosen sides on the scales of justice.
The Jesus papers were prepared by those without sensitivity to the Spirit of Truth nor did they posses a fragment of the Father. Why was this presentation made to those in possession of both of these Spirits and more? The answer is to propagate propaganda for the case of Gabriel vs Lucifer. It is over Gabriel. Why do you continue to insist that we take sides? Give up your vengeance. Come to the feast table that Michael and Father have prepared.
Truthfully, Gabriel, these children of Father’s that you spit on are immune to your consultations. Father is in us that you would sway to your side.
This reply has been reported for inappropriate content.
While there is much to choose from to refute such notions, unfortunately it resides within the book of propaganda as you claim it to be, a tool of rebellion or authoritarianism it would seem, can’t really tell which from your tirade here. But not to be trusted in any case I must presume by your post. And that is what disturbs me most and concerns me for your sake Louis, your utter lack of trust, now expressed as paranoia it seems to me. You don’t trust the authors or Gabriel or Michael or God it seems. I posted plenty of text at TB on this topic and have been reluctant to take up this issue here to allow other voices the opportunity to hear you out and give their perspective without my own intruding upon the process. I have suspected your conclusions for some time but wanted you to clearly proclaim them in your words rather than presume the accuracy of my discernment. Why then are you here or TB if you believe the UB is but celestial propaganda to falsely accuse and execute an innocent, Lucifer and crew, by the angry and hateful mob in heaven as you claimed at TB?
How can one claim it is indeed from celestials and then decry its sinister motive at the same time? Illogical in the extreme. There are many such revisionists among us who take this quote or that to prove their own pre and misconceptions. This presentation of yours is not by the text itself but is using it to “prove” a personal perspective that is becoming well entrenched in a fearful and suspicious mind IMO. Hope I’m wrong.
The Urantia Book has a great and powerful purpose. Its purpose is to separate the wheat from the chaff. It is the last great temptation. It is the temptation of knowledge. It is the temptation of the knowledge of good and evil.
Um, whaaaaat? That entire post is just ….. I have no words.
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