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Has the Lucifer rebellion been adjudicated?
No. But a few people think it has been adjudicated. What do you think?
I wonder why it matters and how it would affect mortal pilgrims, ascenders, and tadpoles?
As a planet evolves through the mortal epochs, only those who attend the broadcast centers get the “news” by broadcast. I can see why the angels would care….but not the mortals on any world at our level of progress.
Would it improve the ministry of the Most Highs to our world? I’m sure I’ve read that Urantia is receiving extraordinary compensatory ministries on many levels so we do NOT suffer any substantial loss while adjudication awaits as individual believers/ascenders.
There are those who claim to be empowered to receive the broadcasts now….and without the “harp” of God. Very special folk indeed!
47:10.2 (539.4) John the Revelator saw a vision of the arrival of a class of advancing mortals from the seventh mansion world to their first heaven, the glories of Jerusem. He recorded: “And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire; and those who had gained the victory over the beast that was originally in them and over the image that persisted through the mansion worlds and finally over the last mark and trace, standing on the sea of glass, having the harps of God, and singing the song of deliverance from mortal fear and death.” (Perfected space communication is to be had on all these worlds; and your anywhere reception of such communications is made possible by carrying the “harp of God,” a morontia contrivance compensating for the inability to directly adjust the immature morontia sensory mechanism to the reception of space communications.)
Me here: so mortals need a mechanical aid/device to receive broadcasts on the Mansion Worlds….but not here? Curious.
52:6.8 (598.3) If you could be transplanted from your backward and confused world to some normal planet now in the postbestowal Son age, you would think you had been translated to the heaven of your traditions. You would hardly believe that you were observing the normal evolutionary workings of a mortal sphere of human habitation. These worlds are in the spiritual circuits of their realm, and they enjoy all the advantages of the universe broadcasts and the reflectivity services of the superuniverse.
110:7.8 (1213.3) During mortal life the material body and mind separate you from your Adjuster and prevent free communication; subsequent to death, after the eternal fusion, you and the Adjuster are one — you are not distinguishable as separate beings — and thus there exists no need for communication as you would understand it.
110:7.9 (1213.4) While the voice of the Adjuster is ever within you, most of you will hear it seldom during a lifetime. Human beings below the third and second circles of attainment rarely hear the Adjuster’s direct voice except in moments of supreme desire, in a supreme situation, and consequent upon a supreme decision.
Me here: but many seem to hear much during this lifetime; however to claim to speak to or receive communications without the normal aids and in addition to or in lieu of TA communication truly baffles me. So someone is spiritual enough to receive messages from somewhere and someone but not spiritual enough for direct TA contact? Really?
I find the whole issue to be ripe with false claims and self delusion, not to mention self importance. We also have circle-counters among us (they claim to know their own circle progress and that of others sometimes) and those who claim to be Planetary Reservists. All such ones are not very well read in the actual Papers to believe or proclaim such standing IMO.
Signs, wonders, miracles, and the priesthood to provide the side show rather than focus upon the true adventure – fusion and eternity for the individual. Such nonsense is a distraction from the work of spiritization while being so concerned with the status of the planet or the system or whatever “news” might be found so compelling and “interesting”. Or so I think.
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I agree with Bradly. It makes no difference to us what happens to Lucifer. Personally, I think it’s a waste of time to even think about it because, even with the full quarantine, the four gravity circuits are unimpaired and our Adjusters are capable of receiving all communications.
108:4.4 When a world is isolated by rebellion, when a planet is cut off from all outside encircuited communication, as was Urantia after the Caligastia upheaval, aside from personal messengers there remains but one possibility of direct interplanetary or universe communication, and that is through the liaison of the Adjusters of the spheres. No matter what happens on a world or in a universe, the Adjusters are never directly concerned. The isolation of a planet in no way affects the Adjusters and their ability to communicate with any part of the local universe, superuniverse, or the central universe. And this is the reason why contacts with the supreme and the self-acting Adjusters of the reserve corps of destiny are so frequently made on quarantined worlds. Recourse is had to such a technique as a means of circumventing the handicaps of planetary isolation. In recent years the archangels’ circuit has functioned on Urantia, but that means of communication is largely limited to the transactions of the archangel corps itself.
109:2.9 Undoubtedly these higher and more experienced types of Adjusters can communicate with those in other realms. But while self-acting Adjusters do thus intercommunicate, they do so only on the levels of their mutual work and for the purpose of preserving custodial data essential to the Adjuster ministry of the realms of their sojourn, though on occasions they have been known to function in interplanetary matters during times of crisis.
Since we know that the Thought Adjusters are getting interplanetary communications, I’m sure we’re soon going to be reading all sorts of messages from alien peoples living on other planets telling us how wonderful it is to have us back in the fold. Just wait for it. The poppycock will come. It’s just a matter of time.
I wonder why it matters and how it would affect mortal pilgrims, ascenders, and tadpoles?
Good question. There were consequences to the Lucifer rebellion. I just now conceived a comparison that goes like this: I grew up in a dysfunctional family and I thought everyone lived like that, until I saw how other families had more harmonious relationships. You know what you know, until you find out something else. The UB offers something else, a vision of what could have been, but was not. The resulting planetary confusion due to the Lucifer rebellion still prevails – confusion even about God.
4:3:3 Much, very much, of the difficulty which Urantia mortals have in understanding God is due to the far-reaching consequences of the Lucifer rebellion and the Caligastia betrayal. On worlds not segregated by sin, the evolutionary races are able to formulate far better ideas of the Universal Father; they suffer less from confusion, distortion, and perversion of concept.If the people of the world were divided into two groups – those who know of the Lucifer rebellion and those who do not, to the ones who do not know it does not matter. If you don’t know something, haven’t ever heard about it, it is unlikely you’ll be held accountable for knowing it. On the other-hand for those who do know about the rebellion, yes, I think it does matter, especially so if the subject is studied. Knowing about it reduces confusion, distortion and perversion of concept. I pose the question “Has the Lucifer rebellion been adjudicated?” to study it with you. Thanks for your input.This reply has been reported for inappropriate content.
Greetings Mara – well….it doesn’t matter to me still….except that it does explain much. I find the fact presented in the UB of the inevitability of L&L to come and the steps of evolutionary progress required to be more interesting and relevant. Unfortunately, too many people, including UB readers, still blame the “devil” for far too much related to our world’s situation and their personal “misfortune”. I rejected such “dependence” long before the UB verified that no pilgrim is separated from Father except by personal choice…and it is mortal free will choice that has both delivered us through the great epochal progress already experienced and retards greater progress that is just personal and social free will choice away from us. What the world needs is love, nothing more than that really.
The world progresses and great strides are already behind us. We are each here so briefly, I simply think it a misguided indulgence to worry about such events (not an accusation – I agree it is an important issue for all believers to contemplate) when the task at hand is always and remains the personal response to the Spirit and Love and to engage with the gravity circuits so that we, each, might be motivated, focused, and activated in love for service to one another. This MUST happen….no matter adjudication or who’s on first celestially speaking. The poor devil is blamed for much that is not true and is given credit for much that is also not true. It is a method of self absolution for the weak, the fearful, and the weary. We can thank the priesthood for such indulgence in falsehoods and fears.
I have full confidence in the Most Highs, the seraphim, Michael, and all our unseen friends in this friendly universe to care for this Shrine of Nebadon….I trust the Spirits of Father, Mother, and Son to attend me all the way to Paradise! I know you do too Sister!! = )
Firstly, if as the UB indicates that if Lucifer were found guilty and adjudicated as is mentioned, he and his cohorts would be as if they had never existed.
I agree, if the Ancients of Days so decree.
So, being that you can even mention his name in this topic would indicate one of two things, which means that first he has not yet been adjudicated or that he was found not-guilty.
Are you saying that using or mentioning the name “Lucifer” means either 1) he has not been adjudicated, or 2) he was found not guilty? What does his name have to do adjudication? I think you’re conflating his name with his theories “self-assertion and liberty.” Do you think his name is going to disappear if he is found guilty as charged?
53:2:2 There were no peculiar or special conditions in the system of Satania which suggested or favored rebellion. It is our belief that the idea took origin and form in Lucifer’s mind, and that he might have instigated such a rebellion no matter where he might have been stationed. Lucifer first announced his plans to Satan, but it required several months to corrupt the mind of his able and brilliant associate. However, when once converted to the rebel theories, he became a bold and earnest advocate of “self-assertion and liberty.”
Where Eve seemed to be interested in as well as Caligastia having worked with the Life Carriers, which might indicate an association with Genetics.
A note about the Life Carriers. Once they get life going, they cease their efforts to supplement life, including any experimentation with genetics.
36:3:6 The Life Carriers of a planetary corps are given a certain period in which to establish life on a new world, approximately one-half million years of the time of that planet. At the termination of this period, indicated by certain developmental attainments of the planetary life, they cease implantation efforts, and they may not subsequently add anything new or supplemental to the life of that planet.36:3:8 When the Life Carriers operating on a new world have once succeeded in producing a being with will, with the power of moral decision and spiritual choice, then and there their work terminates — they are through; they may manipulate the evolving life no further. From this point forward the evolution of living things must proceed in accordance with the endowment of the inherent nature and tendencies which have already been imparted to, and established in, the planetary life formulas and patterns. The Life Carriers are not permitted to experiment or to interfere with will; they are not allowed to dominate or arbitrarily influence moral creatures.36:3:9 Upon the arrival of a Planetary Prince [Caligastia] they prepare to leave, though two of the senior carriers and twelve custodians may volunteer, by taking temporary renunciation vows, to remain indefinitely on the planet as advisers in the matter of the further development and conservation of the life plasm. Two such Sons and their twelve associates are now serving on Urantia.Caligastia showed up and Dalamatia was established 500,000 years ago. And 200,000 year ago Caligastia drank the cool-aid. But the biologic development on Urantia continued apace, until 40,000 years ago when the Life Carriers petitioned for assistance with biologic uplift via the violet race.73:0:1 THE cultural decadence and spiritual poverty resulting from the Caligastia downfall and consequent social confusion had little effect on the physical or biologic status of the Urantia peoples. Organic evolution proceeded apace, quite regardless of the cultural and moral setback which so swiftly followed the disaffection of Caligastia and Daligastia. And there came a time in the planetary history, almost forty thousand years ago, when the Life Carriers on duty took note that, from a purely biologic standpoint, the developmental progress of the Urantia races was nearing its apex. The Melchizedek receivers, concurring in this opinion, readily agreed to join the Life Carriers in a petition to the Most Highs of Edentia asking that Urantia be inspected with a view to authorizing the dispatch of biologic uplifters, a Material Son and Daughter.Eve experimented with the material order of life plasm, because she listened to the insidious propaganda of personal liberty and planetary freedom of action. With one thrust the deed was done. No doubt it also pleased Lucifer, Satan, and Caligastia the prince of darkness.75:8:4 In estimating the results of the Adamic mission on your world, justice demands the recognition of the condition of the planet. Adam was confronted with a well-nigh hopeless task when, with his beautiful mate, he was transported from Jerusem to this dark and confused planet. But had they been guided by the counsel of the Melchizedeks and their associates, and had they been more patient, they would have eventually met with success. But Eve listened to the insidious propaganda of personal liberty and planetary freedom of action. She was led to experiment with the life plasm of the material order of sonship in that she allowed this life trust to become prematurely commingled with that of the then mixed order of the original design of the Life Carriers which had been previously combined with that of the reproducing beings once attached to the staff of the Planetary Prince.Now if we take the Biblical reference from above and link this with the time line mentioned in the UB where “Gabriel came down from Salvington and bound the dragon (all the rebel leaders) for an age”, this “age” is noted as being a thousand years, where if one adds these time lines together, it would indicate that these “rebel leaders” were loosed around the time of the “Middle Ages” or more specifically around “Saeculum obscurum” or the “Dark Ages“, which might make sense based on the turmoil of that time in history.
I do not think the rebel leaders have ever been “loosed” since they were interred on the prison worlds.
45:1:10 The seven satellites surrounding the Father’s world are variously utilized in the different systems. In Satania they are now used as the detention spheres for the interned groups of the Lucifer rebellion. The constellation capital, Edentia, has no analogous prison worlds; the few seraphim and cherubim who went over to the rebels in the Satania rebellion have been long since confined on these isolation worlds of Jerusem.
45:1:11 As a sojourner on the seventh mansion world, you have access to the seventh transition world, the sphere of the Universal Father, and are also permitted to visit the Satania prison worlds surrounding this planet, whereon are now confined Lucifer and the majority of those personalities who followed him in rebellion against Michael. And this sad spectacle has been observable during these recent ages and will continue to serve as a solemn warning to all Nebadon until the Ancients of Days shall adjudicate the sin of Lucifer and his fallen associates who rejected the salvation proffered by Michael, their universe Father.
53:9:4 Satan could come to Urantia because you had no Son of standing in residence — neither Planetary Prince nor Material Son. Machiventa Melchizedek has since been proclaimed vicegerent Planetary Prince of Urantia, and the opening of the case of Gabriel vs. Lucifer has signalized the inauguration of temporary planetary regimes on all the isolated worlds. It is true that Satan did periodically visit Caligastia and others of the fallen princes right up to the time of the presentation of these revelations, when there occurred the first hearing of Gabriel’s plea for the annihilation of the archrebels. Satan is now unqualifiedly detained on the Jerusem prison worlds.53:9:5 Since Michael’s final bestowal no one in all Satania has desired to go to the prison worlds to minister to the interned rebels. And no more beings have been won to the deceiver’s cause. For nineteen hundred years the status has been unchanged.54:4:8 But these mercy delays are not interminable. Notwithstanding the long delay (as time is reckoned on Urantia) in adjudicating the Lucifer rebellion, we may record that, during the time of effecting this revelation, the first hearing in the pending case of Gabriel vs. Lucifer was held on Uversa, and soon thereafter there issued the mandate of the Ancients of Days directing that Satan be henceforth confined to the prison world with Lucifer. This ends the ability of Satan to pay further visits to any of the fallen worlds of Satania. Justice in a mercy-dominated universe may be slow, but it is certain.Which might indicate that the adjudication which you mention is ongoing right now and who knows how long that the cleanup will take?
I agree. Adjudication has begun.
No, it has nothing to do with the name but the history behind the name. Where in this case if Lucifer had been like he had never existed, there would be no record of the rebellion and it would have been stricken even from the UB.
If Lucifer is anhilated from existence, it does not stand up to logic that the history he participated in is also anhilated. Anything of value he accomplished is added to the growth of the Supreme Being. Many orders of beings, including mortal ascenders on Jerusem at the time of the seven years battle on the sea of glass as well as those on the planets that fell, did experience the rebellion and were witness to what happened at that time. Their decisions add to both the Supreme and are bonifide experiences. Those things can’t be erased. Maybe you are thinking of this passage, indicating a temporary erasure on the Jerusem depiction of system history which eventually will be restored.
46:8:1 The purely local and routine affairs of Jerusem are directed from the one hundred triangles. These units are clustered around the ten marvelous structures domiciling the local administration of Jerusem. The triangles are surrounded by the panoramic depiction of the system headquarters history. At present there is an erasure of over two standard miles in this circular story. This sector will be restored upon the readmission of Satania into the constellation family. Every provision for this event has been made by the decrees of Michael, but the tribunal of the Ancients of Days has not yet finished the adjudication of the affairs of the Lucifer rebellion. Satania may not come back into the full fellowship of Norlatiadek so long as it harbors archrebels, high created beings who have fallen from light into darkness.MidiChlorian wrote: If a personality, never existed then no one would identify with any of their actions in past history. This would also indicate that time and memory would also need to be altered or adjusted out, but the main point here is that if this is a true interpretation of what non-existence implies, it would be a very large undertaking throughout the universes. Therefore, not likely but if one believes the text and interprets it this way, possible.
I disagree. Non-existence means the personality is anhilated. The traitors and rebels will be deprived of personality existence. The history will remain.
53:9:7 The rebellion has ended on Jerusem. It ends on the fallen worlds as fast as divine Sons arrive. We believe that all rebels who will ever accept mercy have done so. We await the flashing broadcast that will deprive these traitors of personality existence. We anticipate the verdict of Uversa will be announced by the executionary broadcast which will effect the annihilation of these interned rebels. Then will you look for their places, but they shall not be found. “And they who know you among the worlds will be astonished at you; you have been a terror, but ne ver shall you be any more.” And thus shall all of these unworthy traitors “become as though they had not been.” All await the Uversa decree.However, as is presented in the UB Urantia was an experimental planet where the Life Carriers actually managed to create something which had never been done in Satania.
Yes.
I believe that it is what occurred here, back then which may have been the straw which broke the camels back. It was what was allowed to occur here which was an injustice and being that the Life Carriers washed their hands of it, and placed the blame on others, made the big difference.
You can believe what you want to, but regarding the work of the Life Carriers, the UB text informs us they used previously approved formulas and life patterns.
36:3:2 The corps of Life Carriers commissioned to plant life upon a new world usually consists of one hundred senior carriers, one hundred assistants, and one thousand custodians. The Life Carriers often carry actual life plasm to a new world, but not always. They sometimes organize the life patterns after arriving on the planet of assignment in accordance with formulas previously approved for a new adventure in life establishment. Such was the origin of the planetary life of Urantia.36:3:3 When, in accordance with approved formulas, the physical patterns have been provided, then do the Life Carriers catalyze this lifeless material, imparting through their persons the vital spirit spark; and forthwith do the inert patterns become living matter.I have no idea how you conclude that “some injustice was allowed to occur here”, etc. etc. washed their hands of it, etc. and put the blame on others. I have no idea what you are talking about.
If anything, the rebellion was more of an ethical battle, where I believe that all that Lucifer wanted is that the current rule of this planet attempt to fix the problems which the Life Carriers implanted.
The rebellion was not an ethical battle and the Life Carriers did not implant a problem that needed to be fixed. The Life Carriers implanted life 900,000,000 years ago under protocols and prior approvals.
57:8:7 900,000,000 years ago witnessed the arrival on Urantia of the first Satania scouting party sent out from Jerusem to examine the planet and make a report on its adaptation for a life-experiment station. This commission consisted of twenty-four members, embracing Life Carriers, Lanonandek Sons, Melchizedeks, seraphim, and other orders of celestial life having to do with the early days of planetary organization and administration.57:8:9 In due course arrangements for the planetary occupation were completed by the mixed commission of twelve on Jerusem and approved by the planetary commission of seventy on Edentia. These plans, proposed by the advisory counselors of the Life Carriers, were finally accepted on Salvington. Soon thereafter the Nebadon broadcasts carried the announcement that Urantia would become the stage whereon the Life Carriers would execute their sixtieth Satania experiment designed to amplify and improve the Satania type of the Nebadon life patterns.MidiChlorian wrote:
If this self rule would have been allowed, it would mean that someone would have to admit to their failures.Lucifer promulgated self-rule. That didn’t work out very well, did it? Look were he is now.53:4:2 Self-assertion was the battle cry of the Lucifer rebellion. One of his chief arguments was that, if self-government was good and right for the Melchizedeks and other groups, it was equally good for all orders of intelligence. He was bold and persistent in the advocacy of the “equality of mind” and “the brotherhood of intelligence.” He maintained that all government should be limited to the local planets and their voluntary confederation into the local systems. All other supervision he disallowed. He promised the Planetary Princes that they should rule the worlds as supreme executives. He denounced the location of legislative activities on the constellation headquarters and the conduct of judicial affairs on the universe capital. He contended that all these functions of government should be concentrated on the system capitals and proceeded to set up his own legislative assembly and organized his own tribunals under the jurisdiction of Satan. And he directed that the princes on the apostate worlds do the same.. . . the rebellion was more of an ethical battle,
No. It was a battle for eternal life. It was a battle to sustain every being present and future with the gift of free will choice to do the will of the Final Father, or not do it. Lucifer’s way would attempt to hijack the gift of free will choice.
53:5:7 But this war in heaven was very terrible and very real. While displaying none of the barbarities so characteristic of physical warfare on the immature worlds, this conflict was far more deadly; material life is in jeopardy in material combat, but the war in heaven was fought in terms of life eternal.I hope these selections add light, not heat, to the discussion. This reply has been reported for inappropriate content.
Mara wrote: I have no idea what you are talking about.You’re not alone.
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You present the UB quote which starts with: “There were no peculiar or special conditions in the system of Satania which suggested or favored rebellion.” However, as is presented in the UB Urantia was an experimental planet where the Life Carriers actually managed to create something which had never been done in Satania. I believe that it is what occurred here, back then which may have been the straw which broke the camels back. It was what was allowed to occur here which was an injustice and being that the Life Carriers washed their hands of it, and placed the blame on others, made the big difference. If anything, the rebellion was more of an ethical battle, where I believe that all that Lucifer wanted is that the current rule of this planet attempt to fix the problems which the Life Carriers implanted. If this self rule would have been allowed, it would mean that someone would have to admit to their failures.
I wonder why you “believe” this Midi. Your suspicions that the UB is some form of cover up for this Life Carrier conspiracy to deliberately sabotage Urantia and that our world was the epicenter of the System rebellion was played out many months ago on TruthBook (where you go by the self chosen name “Caligastia” and myself as “fanofVan”). Do you think such distortion and misinformation will have a more eager audience here? What was “allowed to occur here” that you find such an “injustice”?
The UB clearly states the rebellion began in the mind of Lucifer and that Satan and Caligastia became his sworn allies in direct defiance of the will of God and Michael. Your defense of the Prince is puzzling to say the least. Compared to Lucifer, Caligastia was a small player from a small stage and had no standing or power to subvert Lucifer but, rather, it was the other way around.
It is bizarre to me to claim the UB is a gift authored by celestials but is deceptive and untrustworthy as a coverup to heavenly conspiracy.
Another form of revisionism and distortion given with the darkness of doubt and suspicion. This group will not be any more tolerant of such drivel than was TruthBook. Just sayin’…….
I know they do not exist, but I would ask that you provide text which supports such conclusions and “belief”.
53:2.3 (602.6) No one ever suggested rebellion to Lucifer. The idea of self-assertion in opposition to the will of Michael and to the plans of the Universal Father, as they are represented in Michael, had its origin in his own mind. His relations with the Creator Son had been intimate and always cordial. At no time prior to the exaltation of his own mind did Lucifer openly express dissatisfaction about the universe administration. Notwithstanding his silence, for more than one hundred years of standard time the Union of Days on Salvington had been reflectivating to Uversa that all was not at peace in Lucifer’s mind. This information was also communicated to the Creator Son and the Constellation Fathers of Norlatiadek.
53:2.4 (602.7) Throughout this period Lucifer became increasingly critical of the entire plan of universe administration but always professed wholehearted loyalty to the Supreme Rulers. His first outspoken disloyalty was manifested on the occasion of a visit of Gabriel to Jerusem just a few days before the open proclamation of the Lucifer Declaration of Liberty. Gabriel was so profoundly impressed with the certainty of the impending outbreak that he went direct to Edentia to confer with the Constellation Fathers regarding the measures to be employed in case of open rebellion.
53:2.5 (603.1) It is very difficult to point out the exact cause or causes which finally culminated in the Lucifer rebellion. We are certain of only one thing, and that is: Whatever these first beginnings were, they had their origin in Lucifer’s mind….
Me here: So, pray tell, what has this to do with Urantia being a decimal world or the Life Carriers on Urantia?
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As you point out Midi (Caligastia), I have many faults….alas, it is so. One of my traits some find most annoying is my allegiance to the fact that the Papers say what they say and don’t say what they don’t….a very discomforting habitual claim of mine for some it is true.
I do not represent the Papers or the movement or any other or assume any authority or exclusivity to understanding….I claim only to be a tadpole who believes that simple fact posted above…the Papers say what they say…believe what they say, or not, is of no concern to me. But to distort or misstate or misrepresent or otherwise torture what the Papers say is something that always has (and will) draw my response and refutation.
Now it may be ugly and not eloquent and transparent and not clever and less than gracious and these are serious, personal, faults and shortcomings that I do inflict upon others here and thither. Oh well….I am but human and tadpole after all. I will let others and time determine the wisdom and the foolishness of what is written on the matter.
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I confess confusion…I do not “call” you Caligastia….this is the name you chose for yourself. You explain why here:
http://truthbook.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=5110
Just to be clear, your words speak for you and mine speak for me. It is up to the reader to determine motive, priority, intent, strategy, tactic, and objective. I acknowledge my clumsiness and inadequacies, which cannot be refuted nor denied. Best wishes Midi (self described and named “Caligastia”)…may your pilgrim’s path bring light and happiness! Such is the message of the Papers!!!!
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It is bizarre to me to claim the UB is a gift authored by celestials but is deceptive and untrustworthy as a coverup to heavenly conspiracy.
You know, I never thought about it like that. You are spot on Bradly. I mean you really nailed it there. That is so awesome, I can’t tell you how awesome it is. You are amazingly tuned into reality brother. I admire your tenacity, I really do. This is the best ever!! Thank you. I’ve been laughing all day.
MidiChlorian wrote: If one remembers that Lucifer indicated by saying that the ascension plan was perceived as being too extensive because he indicated that soul’s where being translated back to their place of origin within three days or periods.Lucifer did not say souls “were being translated back to their place of origin within three days or periods.” He did condemn the entire mortal ascension plan. He said that finaliters were “debauched” and “they were in reality traitors to their fellow mortals” because they were cooperating with the scheme of enslaving all creation to the fictions of a mythical eternal destiny for ascending mortals – eternal life. He said individuals “should enjoy the liberty of individual self-determination.”
53:3:6 3. The attack upon the universal plan of ascendant mortal training. Lucifer maintained that far too much time and energy were expended upon the scheme of so thoroughly training ascending mortals in the principles of universe administration, principles which he alleged were unethical and unsound. He protested against the agelong program for preparing the mortals of space for some unknown destiny and pointed to the presence of the finaliter corps on Jerusem as proof that these mortals had spent ages of preparation for some destiny of pure fiction. With derision he pointed out that the finaliters had encountered a destiny no more glorious than to be returned to humble spheres similar to those of their origin. He intimated that they had been debauched by overmuch discipline and prolonged training, and that they were in reality traitors to their mortal fellows since they were now co-operating with the scheme of enslaving all creation to the fictions of a mythical eternal destiny for ascending mortals. He advocated that ascenders should enjoy the liberty of individual self-determination. He challenged and condemned the entire plan of mortal ascension as sponsored by the Paradise Sons of God and supported by the Infinite Spirit.MidiChlorian wrote: . . . thereby indicating it was only a war in heaven and a rebellion on “immature worlds” like Urantia.The revelators name the widespread upheaval that happened 200,000 years ago in the system of Satania “The Lucifer Rebellion.” They did not call it the lucifer war or the lucifer war-in-heaven. The Planetary Princes of thirty-seven inhabited planets in Satania were seduced by the sophistries of Lucifer.53:7:1 The Lucifer rebellion was system wide. Thirty-seven seceding Planetary Princes swung their world administrations largely to the side of the archrebel. Only on Panoptia did the Planetary Prince fail to carry his people with him. On this world, under the guidance of the Melchizedeks, the people rallied to the support of Michael. Ellanora, a young woman of that mortal realm, grasped the leadership of the human races, and not a single soul on that strife-torn world enlisted under the Lucifer banner. And ever since have these loyal Panoptians served on the seventh Jerusem transition world as the caretakers and builders on the Father’s sphere and its surrounding seven detention worlds. The Panoptians not only act as the literal custodians of these worlds, but they also execute the personal orders of Michael for the embellishment of these spheres for some future and unknown use. They do this work as they tarry en route to Edentia.MidiChlorian wrote: Although what puzzles me a little is that they came to “a final decision”, and based on the indication that this was a “discussion” or debate, it might seem that this decision might have been to agree to disagree?I think it would help to comprehend “who” was listening to the back and forth discussion. Who were they who arrived at a final decision? The various personalities present where the discussion was taking place!53:5:6 [. . .] In the early days of the struggle Lucifer held forth continuously in the planetary amphitheater. Gabriel conducted an unceasing exposure of the rebel sophistries from his headquarters taken up near at hand. The various personalities present on the sphere who were in doubt as to their attitude would journey back and forth between these discussions until they arrived at a final decision.The discussions and decisions took seven years. It was necessary to let the rebellion fully develop, and it was necessary to provide every opportunity, full and free, for every being to make their own final complete decision – a mature and deliberate choice re The Lucifer Declaration of Liberty.54:5:10 9. On Jerusem the personal representative of the Supreme Executive of Orvonton counseled Gabriel to foster full opportunity for every living creature to mature a deliberate choice in those matters involved in the Lucifer Declaration of Liberty. The issues of rebellion having been raised, the Paradise emergency adviser of Gabriel portrayed that, if such full and free opportunity were not given all Norlatiadek creatures, then would the Paradise quarantine against all such possible halfhearted or doubt-stricken creatures be extended in self-protection against the entire constellation. To keep open the Paradise doors of ascension to the beings of Norlatiadek, it was necessary to provide for the full development of rebellion and to insure the complete determination of attitude on the part of all beings in any way concerned therewith.67:2:6 For more than seven years this struggle continued. Not until every personality concerned had made a final decision, would or did the authorities of Edentia interfere or intervene. Not until then did Van and his loyal associates receive vindication and release from their prolonged anxiety and intolerable suspense.67:3:10 There is no end to the recital of the stirring events of these tragic days. But at last the finaldecision of the last personality was made, and then, but only then, did a Most High of Edentia arrive with the emergency Melchizedeks to seize authority on Urantia. The Caligastia panoramic reign-records on Jerusem were obliterated, and the probationary era of planetary rehabilitation was inaugurated.MidiChlorian wrote: It also indicates that the main conflict was that the Creator Son’s “authority had been challenged.” But,what authority did he have if he had not executed his final sojourn in order to become full sovereign of his universe?I am happy to bring to your attention, Midi, the one and only chief executive and actual administrator of Nebadon -Gabriel of Salvington. He, Gabriel, conducted an unceasing exposure of the rebel sophistries of Lucifer for seven years on the capital of Satania when the rebellion brokeout. BTW the entire judicial mechanism of Nebadon is under his supervision. (33:7:2) Do I need to go back and review all this for you Midi? I thought you were a long-time reader.33:6:1 Gabriel is the chief executive and actual administrator of Nebadon. Michael’s absence from Salvington in no way interferes with the orderly conduct of universe affairs. During the absence of Michael, as recently on the mission of reunion of Orvonton Master Sons on Paradise, Gabriel is the regent of the universe. At such times Gabriel always seeks the counsel of Immanuel of Salvington regarding all major problems.33:4:6 Gabriel is the chief officer of execution for superuniverse mandates relating to nonpersonal affairs in the local universe. Most matters pertaining to mass judgment and dispensational resurrections, adjudicated by the Ancients of Days, are also delegated to Gabriel and his staff for execution. Gabriel is thus the combined chief executive of both the super- and the local universe rulers. He has at his command an able corps of administrative assistants, created for their special work, who are unrevealed to evolutionary mortals. In addition to these assistants, Gabriel may employ any and all of the orders of celestial beings functioning in Nebadon, and he is also the commander in chief of “the armies of heaven” — the celestial hosts.MidiChlorian wrote: Might it have been that there were others who were acting on his behalf, and that their actions might not have been according to the understood plan?Gabriel is the regent of the universe – the entire universe of Nebadon. He’s in charge when our Creator Son is absent. He functions as the personal representative of the Sovereign Son (Michael) and as spokesman for his creative consort (Creative Spirit). He even accompanied Michael on his Urantia bestowal. And among other responsibilities,Gabriel is the “supreme commander of the armies of heaven,” the chief executive of the Sovereign of Nebadon, “the Lord God of hosts.” Look it up. “All Planetary Princes are under the universe administrative jurisdiction of Gabriel, the chief executive of Michael, while in immediate authority they are subject to the executive mandates of the System Sovereigns.” And there is much more about Gabriel to discover in the book.MidiChlorian wrote: We do know that Michael was hesitant in making specific decisions or actions regarding the Rebellion, and that it was primarily “Gabriel volunteered to act as the representative of the Creator Son,” but why did he need to volunteer?The CEO of a company delegates responsibility. Gabriel was delegated to speak for Michael.53:4:6 Gabriel was personally present throughout all these disloyal proceedings and only announced that he would, in due time, speak for Michael, and that all beings would be left free and unmolested in their choice; that the “government of the Sons for the Father desired only that loyalty and devotion which was voluntary, wholehearted, and sophistry-proof.”MidiChlorian wrote: Wouldn’t someone with authority, direct someone to represent them, or perform their own counter-challenge?Someone with authority did represent Michael and perform the counter-challenge to the sophistries of Lucifer on the system capital. Gabriel did.MidiChlorian wrote: One must keep in mind that regardless of what was or was not decided on Jerusem, any adjudication of this type, would not be valid and would need to be presented before “supergovernment” at the superuniverse courts.Yes, exactly. The Ancients of Days on Uversa, the capital of our superuniverse, adjudicates the Lucifer rebellion.MidiChlorian wrote: Although if I’m not mistaken much of the evidence had conveniently gone missing from Jerusem? So, what would need to be done in order to keep from having a mistrial?Recordkeepping is a big deal throughout the universe and universe of universes. There are real, living records. Universe beings can’t fake their way to a mistrial. Mercy is offered. Justice prevails. There are no do-overs. Can’t run; can’t hide.17:3:6 The formal records of the universes are passed up by and through the angelic recorders, but the true spiritual records are assembled by reflectivity and are preserved in the minds of suitable and appropriate personalities belonging to the family of the Infinite Spirit. These are the live records in contrast with the formal and dead records of the universe, and they are perfectly preserved in the living minds of the recording personalities of the Infinite Spirit.25:5:2 The recording angels of the inhabited planets are the source of all individual records. Throughout the universes other recorders function regarding both formal records and living records. From Urantia to Paradise, both recordings are encountered: in a local universe, more of the written records and less of the living; on Paradise, more of the living and less of the formal; on Uversa, both are equally available.28:6:5 2. The Memory of Mercy. These are the actual, full and replete, living records of the mercy which has been extended to individuals and races by the tender ministrations of the instrumentalities of the Infinite Spirit in the mission of adapting the justice of righteousness to the status of the realms, as disclosed by the portrayals of the Significance of Origins. The Memory of Mercy discloses the moral debt of the children of mercy — their spiritual liabilities — to be set down against their assets of the saving provision established by the Sons of God. In revealing the Father’s pre-existent mercy, the Sons of God establish the necessary credit to insure the survival of all. And then, in accordance with the findings of the Significance of Origins, a mercy credit is established for the survival of each rational creature, a credit of lavish proportions and one of sufficient grace to insure the survival of every soul who really desires divine citizenship.28:6:6 The Memory of Mercy is a living trial balance, a current statement of your account with the supernatural forces of the realms. These are the living records of mercy ministration which are read into the testimony of the courts of Uversa when each individual’s right to unending life comes up for adjudication, when “thrones are cast up and the Ancients of Days are seated. The broadcasts of Uversa issue and come forth from before them; thousands upon thousands minister to them, and ten thousand times ten thousand stand before them. The judgment is set, and the books are opened.” And the books which are opened on such a momentous occasion are the living records of the tertiary seconaphim of the superuniverses. The formal records are on file to corroborate the testimony of the Memories of Mercy if they are required.MidiChlorian wrote: . . . regardless of the lack of facts presented in the UB.Yeah, but let’s get it right. Shall we?This reply has been reported for inappropriate content.
In his first post on this thread (post-#21499) claimed the fact that Mara could speak the name of Lucifer is proof that either the adjudication has not taken place or that he has been acquitted. I’d like to know if anyone other than thinks that annihilation of Lucifer’s identity would also annihilate all memory, in all other persons in the grand universe, of him ever existing. Would all of our minds be reprogrammed to eliminate him also? When we read about him in books, having no memory of him, will he seem like a mythical character? According to the phrase “as though he had not been,” means erasing everything that has to do with him (excluding the spiritual stuff grabbed by spirit gravity of course). If that line of thinking is correct, then the fact that we can mention the names of evil mass murderers from ancient history, and even Judas himself, indicates that they still exist on the mansion worlds somewhere.Also, what happens to the far-flung repercussions of Lucifer’s sins after his annihilation? If is correct, then the repercussions of his sin on our planet will also become, “as though he had not been.” They would be erased too, right? Wouldn’t that make us almost normal, like magic? Personally, I think it’s all poppycock.67:7.7 Sin is wholly personal as to moral guilt or spiritual consequences, notwithstanding its far-flung repercussions in administrative, intellectual, and social domains.
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Thank you Mara for your ever vigilante patience and tenacity in allowing the Papers to speak for themselves by such mastery of scholarship and presentation. As charged, I’m often far too impatient and emotional and do not serve dissemination graciously….certainly not so well as so many others.
I always found the greatest good news in this book of good news to be how well managed the universe of universes is and how it is propelled into eternity by love and friendliness and mutual cooperation and service….just like the Muskateers shouted – one for all and all for one!
This gift we share together is a beacon of light and assurance to guide the pilgrims of time and space to the inner life and light which is freely gifted to us all. There is nothing within us or the Papers which should result in doubt, fear, suspicion, accusation of corruption of either motive or act by our rulers or the authors or the authority which delivered it to us, or any form of darkness to mind. Even for those who may not yet or may not ever believe its claims, I simply do not understand how any thing within might be considered sinister or threatening to any pilgrim…either within text or upon this confused world. The Most Highs rule – Fear Not! Which means, to me, that we are to fear nothing for ourselves or for our world.
It has been suggested here that Lucifer’s mind “received” his disloyalty rather than originate it by freewill. Another direct contradiction of what is written. All that is right and true and all that is wrong and false are the result of free will…our own and all others. It is God’s will that we love one another and serve one another in glorious adventure as delighted children in a wondrous universe. There is no place for suspicion and accusation in such a reality…especially regarding the purpose, plan, and power of the First Source and Center….or our Creator, now Master Son of Nebadon and elder brother Michael or the Bright and Morning Star, the first born of Nebadon whose loyalty and wisdom will forever be our example on the path to Paradise and Finaliter service in eternity to come.
Let us be joyful as we study this gift of light and great hope! And remain vigilante regarding those who seem intent on inserting fear, suspicion, even paranoia about love, mercy, and justice in God’s universe. Such darkness is the residual and temporal effects of the animal nature and the most primitive forms of evolutionary religion which taints our world still today….but only because it is chosen and embraced by those with free will.
But we are assured all such temporal evil/error is not reality nor will it keep us from reality – the reality of love, mercy, and service in the family of creation. Each of us may overcome this on this world or the next simply by choosing reality…and laying aside doubt and fear.
Thanks to all who attend here and share your perspective of truth, beauty, and goodness. And thanks for your patience with my own very real faults and failures. Don’t worry….be happy!
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