Entropy – who says!

Home Forums Science & History Entropy – who says!

Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 77 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #10780
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant
    emanny3003 wrote: I agree. The Life Carriers cannot start over again for this planet but they gather their wares and learn from their mistakes and start over again on another planet that will be ready for the next billion year cycle or either a little further along in this cycle. The point is that plant and animal require the shining suns of the 1 billions year day cycle.

    Yet they tell us that your sun is 6 billion years old and is in a period of greatest economy and will continue to be so for more than 25 billion years.(41:9.5)  How does that fit into your 1 billion year cycle?

    Enthalpy is just the opposite and is what occurs during the contraction cycle where energy condenses into matter-mass. Both entropy and enthalpy are intimately linked to space respirations.

    Here is where I think you make a leap of logic.  The contractions of space respiration have to do with the motion of SPACE toward and away from nether Paradise.  Thermodynamics is a relationship between heat and energy.  Space is not heat or energy.  Heat and energy fill pervaded space, but it is not space.(11:5.9)   Space contains and conditions motion, and it even moves, but the thermodynamic relationships within space are not necessarily related to space itself. Which means that the laws of heat and energy do not necessarily apply to space, which is merely the vehicle for those reactions/relationships.

    emanny3003 wrote: This is precisely why I think that apart from many other functions, these made to order spheres serve as living abodes for the ascending mortal when the billion years of cosmic night do not allow for life on the evolving physical spheres.

    I agree that the architectural abodes house both ascending and descending beings, but there is no such thing as cosmic night.  It will never happen, just like the Big Crunch, the Big Chill and the Big Rip will never happen. Cosmic night is not real; however, cosmic insight is very real.

    #10781
    Avatar
    emanny3003
    Blocked

    Yes, the author did not mention the central universe in that one particular quote.  But consider the fact that the central universe is part of pervaded space (12:1.3-4),  and ALL of space, pervaded and unpervaded, participates in space respiration (11:6.1).

    12:4.7 Space is, from the human viewpoint, nothing—negative; it exists only as related to something positive and nonspatial. Space is, however, real. It contains and conditions motion. It even moves. Space motions may be roughly classified as follows:

    1. Primary motion—space respiration, the motion of space itself.
    2. Secondary motion—the alternate directional swings of the successive space levels.
    3. Relative motions—relative in the sense that they are not evaluated with Paradise as a base point. Primary and secondary motions are absolute, motion in relation to unmoving Paradise.
    4. Compensatory or correlating movement designed to co-ordinate all other motions.

    While un-pervaded space participates in space respiration, it does not participate in the secondary motion of space as defined above.

    And while the Central Universe is part of pervaded space it participates in secondary motion of as defined above but not necessarily the primary motion of space respiration.

    12:1.10 Havona, the central universe, is not a time creation; it is an eternal existence. This never-beginning, never-ending universe consists of one billion spheres of sublime perfection and is surrounded by the enormous dark gravity bodies. At the center of Havona is the stationary and absolutely stabilized Isle of Paradise, surrounded by its twenty-one satellites. Owing to the enormous encircling masses of the dark gravity bodies about the fringe of the central universe, the mass content of this central creation is far in excess of the total known mass of all seven sectors of the grand universe.

    Perfect spheres rotate but do not expand or contract. The billion spheres of Havona are not charged bodies as those of evolutionary physical creation. The dark gravity bodies surrounding the Central Universe do not participate in this respiration of space, its primary motion. The Central Universe is not a time creation; it is an eternal existence.

    #10782
    Avatar
    emanny3003
    Blocked

    Yet they tell us that your sun is 6 billion years old and is in a period of greatest economy and will continue to be so for more than 25 billion years.(41:9.5)  How does that fit into your 1 billion year cycle?

    It fits nicely. For 1 billion years it radiates energy and expends mass. Then for the billion years of contraction the Sun regenerates mass to again radiate in the next expansion cycle. Efficiency pertains to how much mass the Sun can regain per cycle. This efficiency may not be sustainable for more than x billions of years if the Sun is not in line with currents of energy that can recharge its batteries sufficiently.

    #10785
    Avatar
    emanny3003
    Blocked

    Here is where I think you make a leap of logic.  The contractions of space respiration have to do with the motion of SPACE toward and away from nether Paradise.  Thermodynamics is a relationship between heat and energy.  Space is not heat or energy.  Heat and energy fill pervaded space, but it is not space.(11:5.9)   Space contains and conditions motion, and it even moves, but the thermodynamic relationships within space are not necessarily related to space itself. Which means that the laws of heat and energy do not necessarily apply to space, which is merely the vehicle for those reactions/relationships.

    42:4.1 Light, heat, electricity, magnetism, chemism, energy, and matter are—in origin, nature, and destiny—one and the same thing, together with other material realities as yet undiscovered on Urantia.

    Matter resides in space but recall that space is a part of matter. Matter contains space. Matter, heat and energy all contain space. How are they not intimately related?

    #10786
    Avatar
    emanny3003
    Blocked

    I agree that the architectural abodes house both ascending and descending beings, but there is no such thing as cosmic night.  It will never happen, just like the Big Crunch, the Big Chill and the Big Rip will never happen. Cosmic night is not real; however, cosmic insight is very real.

    30:0.2 It is not possible to formulate comprehensive and entirely consistent classifications of the personalities of the grand universe because all of the groups are not revealed. It would require numerous additional papers to cover the further revelation required to systematically classify all groups. Such conceptual expansion would hardly be desirable as it would deprive the thinking mortals of the next thousand years of that stimulus to creative speculation which these partially revealed concepts supply. It is best that man not have an overrevelation; it stifles imagination.

    How would describe the relationship between cosmic insight and imagination?

    #10801
    Avatar
    emanny3003
    Blocked

    Here is TUB quote that ties space directly to heat and energy and light and chemism and matter (material bodies), etc.

    118:3.5 Space comes the nearest of all nonabsolute things to being absolute. Space is apparently absolutely ultimate. The real difficulty we have in understanding space on the material level is due to the fact that, while material bodies exist in space, space also exists in these same material bodies. While there is much about space that is absolute, that does not mean that space is absolute.

    118:3.6 It may help to an understanding of space relationships if you would conjecture that, relatively speaking, space is after all a property of all material bodies. Hence, when a body moves through space, it also takes all its properties with it, even the space which is in and of such a moving body.

    #10814
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant
    emanny3003 wrote: While un-pervaded space participates in space respiration, it does not participate in the secondary motion of space as defined above. And while the Central Universe is part of pervaded space it participates in secondary motion of as defined above but not necessarily the primary motion of space respiration.

    I must be blind or something.  I don’t read any such thing in the quote you posted.  There’s no mention at all of pervaded or unpervaded space in that quote.  Perhaps if I reproduce the quotes I referenced and point out specifically what I’m talking about you might appreciate my point of view. In the next quote please note that the space levels encircling the central isle of Paradise are all part of pervaded space, and this includes the Central Universe of Havona which is a part of the horizontal extension of pervaded space.

    12:1.3-9 Proceeding outward from Paradise through the horizontal extension of pervaded space, the master universe is existent in six concentric ellipses, the space levels encircling the central Isle:

    1. The Central Universe – Havona.
    2. The Seven Superuniverses.
    3. The First Outer Space Level.
    4. The Second Outer Space Level.
    5.  The Third Outer Space Level.
    6. The Fourth and Outermost Space Level.

    Now, please consider the following quote which states that All space alternately contracts and expands, including both the horizontal extension of pervaded space, of which the Central Universe is a part, and the vertical extension of unpervaded space.

    11:6.1 We do not know the actual mechanism of space respiration; we merely observe that all space alternately contracts and expands. This respiration affects both the horizontal extension of pervaded space and the vertical extensions of unpervaded space which exist in the vast space reservoirs above and below Paradise. In attempting to imagine the volume outlines of these space reservoirs, you might think of an hourglass.

    Space movement in the horizontal extension must pass through the Central Universe on its way to Paradise where it flows through the transmuting regulation channels and is transformed to unperaded space.

    11:6.2 As the universes of the horizontal extension of pervaded space expand, the reservoirs of the vertical extension of unpervaded space contract and vice versa. There is a confluence of pervaded and unpervaded space just underneath nether Paradise. Both types of space there flow through the transmuting regulation channels, where changes are wrought making pervadable space nonpervadable and vice versa in the contraction and expansion cycles of the cosmos.

    emanny3003 wrote:Perfect spheres rotate but do not expand or contract. The billion spheres of Havona are not charged bodies as those of evolutionary physical creation. The dark gravity bodies surrounding the Central Universe do not participate in this respiration of space, its primary motion. The Central Universe is not a time creation; it is an eternal existence.
    It is the space that is respiring, not the bodies within the space. If you fill a balloon with ionized confetti and blow it up, expand it with more space, the particles of confetti will move apart.  If you allow some of the air to be released, thus contracting the space, the confetti particles will be closer together, but they will still be there in their same relationships.

    emanny3003 wrote: Matter resides in space but recall that space is a part of matter. Matter contains space. Matter, heat and energy all contain space. How are they not intimately related?

    Yes they are related in part, but that doesn’t mean that they all take part equally in the whole.  For instance, we all exist within God and God exists within us.  We all have a fragment of God within us with whom we are intimately related.  Even so, we as individuals do not take part in all of God’s activities.  All the matter and energy of space may contain space, just as each of us contains a fragment of God, but that does not mean that the space within matter participates in all activities and functions of space.

    #10815
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant

    How would describe the relationship between cosmic insight and imagination?

    They are not the same thing.  Cosmic insight is consciousness of spiritual meanings and values.  Imagination, on the other hand, is not necessarily spiritual in nature.  It is not possible to understand cosmic problems from only a scientific or mathematical viewpoint, imaginative or otherwise.  You must also consider the philosophical and spiritual aspects when contemplating cosmic relationships.

    103:7.8 The truth — an understanding of cosmic relationships, universe facts, and spiritual values — can best be had through the ministry of the Spirit of Truth and can best be criticized by revelation. But revelation originates neither a science nor a religion; its function is to co-ordinate both science and religion with the truth of reality. Always, in the absence of revelation or in the failure to accept or grasp it, has mortal man resorted to his futile gesture of metaphysics, that being the only human substitute for the revelation of truth or for the mota of morontia personality.

    #10828
    Avatar
    emanny3003
    Blocked

    I must be blind or something.  I don’t read any such thing in the quote you posted.  There’s no mention at all of pervaded or unpervaded space in that quote.  Perhaps if I reproduce the quotes I referenced and point out specifically what I’m talking about you might appreciate my point of view.

    But I do appreciate your point of view. My confusion comes when one is asked to visualize un-pervaded space as an hourglass and then asked to accept that it moves exactly as pervaded space. With pervaded space is easy to see both primary and secondary motions of space. Un-pervaded space cannot undergo secondary motion of rotating around Paradise as does pervaded space.

    Pervade space participates in both primary and secondary motions of space but un-pervaded space can only participate in primary motion (respiration).

    It is the space that is respiring, not the bodies within the space.

    If all of space is respiring, and I agree that all of space does, then the space that is a part of matter must also respire. All matter must likewise exhibit the motions of space. All of time-space creations must have these same motions. The Earth and all space bodies must expand and contract as they rotate about their centers. This is the pattern of all motion.

    Even so, we as individuals do not take part in all of God’s activities.  All the matter and energy of space may contain space, just as each of us contains a fragment of God, but that does not mean that the space within matter participates in all activities and functions of space.

    I agree that we as individuals do not take part in all of God’s activities but God certainly takes part in all of our activities. Space and time are inseparable and there is no time without motion. Neither is there material time-space creations without motion. Nature can be viewed as the habits of God.

    When I quoted TUB when it says that the Central Universe is not a time creation, well, my next question is; is the Central universe a space creation? We know it is not a time-space creation because it exists in eternity. Space is sub-absolute yet the absolute of time is eternity. Is the space of the Central Universe different in some way? We know that its materialization is very different.

    Does time and space part ways in some way unrevealed when it comes to the Central Universe? Does the Central Universe participate in secondary space motion but not primary space motion? Secondary space motion is absolute. It follows the Eternal Ellipse. Primary space motion is also absolute but it reflects every billions years. Why is space described as absolutely Ultimate but still sub-absolute?

    Is space absolute in the Central Universe? Are we not talking about a perfect, eternal and absolute creation or did the Central Universe eventuate? Can you see my confusion? This is why I surmise that the Central Universe may not participate in space respirations.

    Cosmic night is simply my term to speculate about what the Universe would do differently in contraction phase. Since radiation is associated with decreasing density, I conclude that when the Universe is contracting, the stars dim. We start a rest and regenerative phase. When we as ascenders arrive in Havona it is the end of days (and nights). When we achieve Paradise it is the end of time.

    Perfect spheres can carry no charge. It like a neutron. They spin but do not expand and contract as do their charged relatives. A perfect sphere has no motion differential across its equator. Is space minus its primary motion absolute? Is the space of the Central Universe absolute?

    You must also consider the philosophical and spiritual aspects when contemplating cosmic relationships.

    I completely agree.

    #10864
    Avatar
    emanny3003
    Blocked

    Here is what TUB says about density and how it relates mass and space.

    41:4.2 Gaseous, liquid, and solid states are matters of atomic-molecular relationships, but density is a relationship of space and mass. Density varies directly with the quantity of mass in space and inversely with the amount of space in mass, the space between the central cores of matter and the particles which whirl around these centers as well as the space within such material particles.

    #10893
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant
    emanny3003 wrote:  My confusion comes when one is asked to visualize un-pervaded space as an hourglass and then asked to accept that it moves exactly as pervaded space. With pervaded space is easy to see both primary and secondary motions of space. Un-pervaded space cannot undergo secondary motion of rotating around Paradise as does pervaded space.

    Agreed. Horizontal pervaded space and vertical unpervaded space form a maltese cross and both spaces continually move back and forth, in and out of each space into the other.  Secondary space motion has to do with clockwise and counterclockwise rotation of the various space levels around Paradise.  Since unpervaded space does not have different space levels, it would seemingly not have secondary motion.

    emanny3003 wrote:  If all of space is respiring, and I agree that all of space does, then the space that is a part of matter must also respire.

    Agreed.  However space does not respond to gravity.  It is possible that space moves through matter.

    emanny3003 wrote:  Space and time are inseparable and there is no time without motion. Neither is there material time-space creations without motion.

    Time and space are inseparable only in the time-space creations of the seven super universes.  But in mind, space and time are separable; consciousness of time can exist in the absence of motion.  I think it would be more accurate to say that relationships to time do not exist without motion or sequence.

    12:5.5 Relationships to time do not exist without motion in space, but consciousness of time does. Sequentiality can consciousize time even in the absence of motion. Man’s mind is less time-bound than space-bound because of the inherent nature of mind. Even during the days of the earth life in the flesh, though man’s mind is rigidly space-bound, the creative human imagination is comparatively time free. But time itself is not genetically a quality of mind.

    emanny3003 wrote:    Is the space of the Central Universe different in some way? We know that its materialization is very different.

    Why would the space of the Central Universe be different than any other space?  Space is space.  There is nothing written to suggest that space changes in any way except moving from pervaded to unpervaded and vice versa.

    emanny3003 wrote:  Does time and space part ways in some way unrevealed when it comes to the Central Universe?

    Space exists but time doesn’t.  Time only exists in relation to something, be it motion or sequence, so they really don’t need to separate time and space.

    emanny3003 wrote:  Does the Central Universe participate in secondary space motion but not primary space motion?

    Space is space.  It doesn’t matter where in the maltese cross it happens to be.  Primary means the main, predominate motion of space.  It makes sense that all space would take part in something that is primary, first and fundamental.  You can’t have secondary without primary motion, in my opinion. I don’t think the authors would label space motion in such a way if it were otherwise.

    emanny3003 wrote:  Secondary space motion is absolute. It follows the Eternal Ellipse. Primary space motion is also absolute but it reflects every billions years.

    The motion of space is not space.  Motion is not inherent in space (12:4.2)

    emanny3003 wrote:  Why is space described as absolutely Ultimate but still sub-absolute?

    You must be referring to this quote:

    118:3.5 Space comes the nearest of all nonabsolute things to being absolute. Space is apparently absolutely ultimate. The real difficulty we have in understanding space on the material level is due to the fact that, while material bodies exist in space, space also exists in these same material bodies. While there is much about space that is absolute, that does not mean that space is absolute.

    Note that they do not capitalize the word.  What they mean is that space is fundamental and final in its existence and function.  Space is not absolute because it has limits and is pervaded by the Unqualified Absolute.

    12:5.2 Space is not infinite, even though it takes origin from Paradise; not absolute, for it is pervaded by the Unqualified Absolute.

    emanny3003 wrote: Is space absolute in the Central Universe?

    No.  Space is space; no matter where it is, it is not absolute.

    emanny3003 wrote:  Are we not talking about a perfect, eternal and absolute creation or did the Central Universe eventuate?

    Yes, the Central Universe did eventuate. (0:3.22)  Havona is neither a time or space creation. But it does exist within pervaded space.  Time on Havona is arbitrarily recognized because “space respiration destroys its local value as a time source.” (12:5.1)

    emanny3003 wrote:  Is the space of the Central Universe absolute?

    Does this quote answer your question?

    105:7.2 That which is transcendental is not necessarily nondevelopmental, but it is superevolutional in the finite sense; neither is it nonexperiential, but it is superexperience as such is meaningful to creatures. Perhaps the best illustration of such a paradox is the central universe of perfection: It is hardly absolute — only the Paradise Isle is truly absolute in the “materialized” sense. Neither is it a finite evolutionary creation as are the seven superuniverses. Havona is eternal but not changeless in the sense of being a universe of nongrowth. It is inhabited by creatures (Havona natives) who never were actually created, for they are eternally existent. Havona thus illustrates something which is not exactly finite nor yet absolute. Havona further acts as a buffer between absolute Paradise and finite creations, still further illustrating the function of transcendentals. But Havona itself is not a transcendental — it is Havona.

    emanny3003 wrote:  Here is what TUB says about density and how it relates mass and space.

    Yes, and it says nothing about motion, only relationships.  Space still moves even if it is within material particles.

    #10901
    Avatar
    nelsong
    Participant

    If you take away space, what remains?

    My imagination says nothing:  space and nothing in my imagination are synonymous just because there is no preceptable difference..

    #10924
    Avatar
    emanny3003
    Blocked

    Agreed.  However space does not respond to gravity.  It is possible that space moves through matter.

    TUB does clearly state the space is not gravity responsive, but space is a property of matter. And matter is controlled by gravity. Therefore, the space that is a part of matter must do what matter does and matter does what gravity tells it to do. I disagree that space moves through matter. If it did it would displace the space that is part of that matter. Space is real. It is a reality that exists as a part of matter and that space belonging to matter cannot just be pushed aside.

    Time and space are inseparable only in the time-space creations of the seven super universes.  But in mind, space and time are separable; consciousness of time can exist in the absence of motion.  I think it would be more accurate to say that relationships to time do not exist without motion or sequence.

    So I see that you agree that the super universes are distinct from Havona. This I will take to be consistant with my contention that Havona is non-breathing. Time and space are separable, but only in theory, and only in mind, and only in mind of the Paradise level.

    Why would the space of the Central Universe be different than any other space?  Space is space.  There is nothing written to suggest that space changes in any way except moving from pervaded to unpervaded and vice versa.

    If The Central Universe is not a time creation, as TUB states, then what is to say that it is a space creation? I agree that space does not change in any other way other than from unpervaded to pervaded space and visa versa. However, do time and space exist in Havona even thought it is not a time-space creation? The spheres of Havona certainly move. They must move in space and it takes time for them to revolve around Paradise.

    Space exists but time doesn’t.  Time only exists in relation to something, be it motion or sequence, so they really don’t need to separate time and space.

    Either time exists or it does not. If it can exist in mind it must exist. Existence exists. Havona is then related to time by virtue of its motion around Paradise. Havona is related to space because, as you say, they don’t to need separate time and space.

    No.  Space is space; no matter where it is, it is not absolute.

    I agree. What moves cannot be absolute.

    The motion of space is not space.  Motion is not inherent in space (12:4.2)

    Motion may not be inherent in space but space does move and someone or something moves it. The motion of matter is not matter. Is motion is inherent in matter? We are not told, but it must move otherwise it would not be material. And matter moves through space and takes the space that is of matter along for the ride.

    Space is not absolute because it has limits and is pervaded by the Unqualified Absolute.

    This tells us that something absolute cannot pervade another absolute, which makes perfect sense. This is why the Thought Adjusters can pervade finite mind.

    Time on Havona is arbitrarily recognized because “space respiration destroys its local value as a time source.” (12:5.1)

    I think you might have taken this quote out of context. They are not necessarily referring to time on Havona but to a universal time unit based on motion. And in the universe in general, the ‘totality’ of space respiration destroys motion’s local value as a time source. Havona is the exception in so far as the Paradise-Havona standard day is arbitrarily so recognized. This is how I read it.

    Yes, the Central Universe did eventuate. (0:3.22)  Havona is neither a time or space creation. But it does exist within pervaded space.

    Ok. We agree that Havona was eventuated and is neither a time or space creation. Havona has a relationship with time in that it contains motion. It has a relationship to space because its spheres move through space. But is that space pervaded with forces and energies such is required of space-time creations? Is the space that the spheres of Havona moves through pervaded by the Unqualified Absolute? Is Havona energized by the same mechanism as the space-time creations? No. Is the materialization of Havona the same as the space-time creations? No. Does the materializations of Havona contain space as do the materializations of space-time? My guess would be that they do not. The spheres of Havona are perfect. I would think that a perfect existence does not require the pervaded presence of the Unqualified Absolute. I do not think that Havona exists within pervaded space.

    Recall now the enormous dark gravity bodies that enshroud the Central Universe and effectively renders it invisible from the Super-universes. The material from which they are made neither absorbs nor reflects light (energy). They are dark bodies so they do not radiate energy either. This leaves only one possibility. This wall of special materialization must bend the energy that approached it and shunts it around but not through Havona. Presumably, to the midspace zones where it is rendered free from the energies and forces of pervaded space and proceeds to un-pervaded space. I must now draw the conclusion that the space that exists in Havona is neither pervaded space nor un-pervaded space, but space that is self contained and exclusive to Havona. It is a space that does not move at all because motion is not inherent in space, as we have agreed on.

    Space still moves even if it is within material particles.

    Yes, I agree. That goes back to my contention that the spheres of space-time expand and contract as they rotate. This explain crustal shifting and continental drift. Also the unexplained confusion about tides not entirely accounted for by sun and moon forces. It explains geothermal phenomenon from friction, volcanoes, and sudden crustal movements called earthquakes which still occur at about 15 occurrences per day.

    #10925
    Avatar
    emanny3003
    Blocked

    If you take away space, what remains?
    My imagination says nothing:  space and nothing in my imagination are synonymous just because there is no preceptable difference..

    Hi Nelsong,

    In my opinion if you take away space you also take way time. What you have left is void. That infinite and eternal void we refer to as Paradise. Our ascension career is a process of shedding our space-time. I guess that one can consider Paradise as nothing in the sense of “no thing”. Thing are objects and objects are material in space-time. Space is nothing only to the human perception. But space is real, it even moves.

    #10971
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant
    emanny3003 wrote: . . . but space is a property of matter. And matter is controlled by gravity. Therefore, the space that is a part of matter must do what matter does and matter does what gravity tells it to do.

    That doesn’t sound logical to me.  It’s like saying that God is love therefore love is God, which is not true.  In a contest between space and matter, space will win.  Not being subject to gravity, space will follow its primary transit regardless of where it is or what other forces are present within it.

    emanny3003 wrote:  So I see that you agree that the super universes are distinct from Havona. This I will take to be consistant with my contention that Havona is non-breathing. Time and space are separable, but only in theory, and only in mind, and only in mind of the Paradise level.

    No, do not take what I said to be consistent with your ideas.  You are mistaken about that.  I attest that Havona DOES take part in space respiration.  Time and space are indeed separable in any mind, including yours and mine, not just Paradise level mind.  Consider the following quote:

    p135:04, 12:5.5 Relationships to time do not exist without motion in space, but consciousness of time does. Sequentiality can consciousize time even in the absence of motion. Man’s mind is less time-bound than space-bound because of the inherent nature of mind. Even during the days of the earth life in the flesh, though man’s mind is rigidly space-bound, the creative human imagination is comparatively time free. But time itself is not genetically a quality of mind.

    emanny3003 wrote:  This wall of special materialization must bend the energy that approached it and shunts it around but not through Havona. Presumably, to the midspace zones where it is rendered free from the energies and forces of pervaded space and proceeds to un-pervaded space.

    But energy is not space.  Space is the womb in which energies and forces are contained. Bending energy and force around Havona does not necessarily mean that space will follow suit. Furthermore, the midspace zones are quiescent, which means inactive and dormant.  Inactive means no motion; albeit, the author concedes that there must be some relative motion, but knows little or nothing about it (11:7.2). I’m sure they would mention that midspace respires and moves if such a thing actually occurred.  Likewise, dormant means no force or energy.   The midspace zone is where time transitions to eternity. (12:5.4)  Nor is it stated that space is rendered free of energies and forces in the midspace zone.  This transformation takes place in the transmuting regulation channels located just below nether Paradise where there is a confluence, or merging, of pervaded and unpervaded space.  This cannot be quiescent midspace if it contains transmuting regulation channels of respiring space. Moreover, we know that all force-energy originates and returns to nether Paradise, not the midspace zone. (11:5.5; 11:5.9)

    emanny3003 wrote:  In my opinion if you take away space you also take way time. What you have left is void. That infinite and eternal void we refer to as Paradise. Our ascension career is a process of shedding our space-time. I guess that one can consider Paradise as nothing in the sense of “no thing”. Thing are objects and objects are material in space-time. Space is nothing only to the human perception. But space is real, it even moves.

    How do you figure that Paradise is a void?   Void means completely empty.  Paradise is not empty.  Paradise is the place of origin for all forms of reality.  Is reality a void?  Is God a void?  And, we don’t shed space-time during our ascension career, we incorporate and unify it with spirit.  The synthesis of space-time experience by the power of a spirit dominated personality is what the Supreme is all about. Perhaps you mean that we shed our resistance to spirit gravity? Also, don’t forget that Paradise is the pattern for all material things.  (0:5.5; 115:3.14; 130:4.2)

     

Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 77 total)

Login to reply to this topic.

Not registered? Sign up here.