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Leaves are falling all around
It’s time I was on my way
Thanks to you I’m much obliged
For such a pleasant stay
But now it’s time for me to go
The autumn moon lights my way
For now I smell the rain
And with it pain
And it’s headed my wayAh, sometimes I grow so tired
But I know I’ve got one thing I got to doRamble onFirst of all, there’s no such thing as faith in a book. That’s not possible as I understand it. Faith is something you have in another personality, human or divine.
This is literally true. On the other hand, it is possible to believe in the truth expressed in words written down in a physical Book. If it is possible to believe in the truth of these words, isn’t it also possible to trust the personality who authored these words? to have faith in their truthfulness? Since we have no access to any knowledge which might conclusively validate the content of this Book, what reason do we have for believing in its truth except the insight of faith?
George Park wrote: If it is possible to believe in the truth of these words, isn’t it also possible to trust the personality who authored these words?It’s all about meanings and values. Are the words true or the meanings of the words true? I say it’s the meanings and meanings are something found in the higher mind. As for trusting a personality you don’t know and cannot interact with, I suppose you can choose to do that, but isn’t it better to trust a personality you do know and can interact with . . . Michael/Jesus/Spirit of Truth? A personality who is willing to exchange his mind with yours?
Have you met any of the personalities who authored the book? I haven’t. I have met the Spirit of Truth who sojourns with my soul. And I know all about his earth life which means I am much closer to him than any personality who authored the book. I tend to trust him to help my mind recognize and interpret the meanings presented in TUB then make them real. True meanings are only realized on supermaterial levels. Let me ask you this . . . are any of the TUB authors, whom you trust, living in the supermaterial level of your mind (aka soul)?
6:0.3 The perfect personality of the Son discloses that the Father is actually the eternal and universal source of all the meanings and values of the spiritual, the volitional, the purposeful, and the personal.
111:3.5 The mortal career, the soul’s evolution, is not so much a probation as an education. Faith in the survival of supreme values is the core of religion; genuine religious experience consists in the union of supreme values and cosmic meanings as a realization of universal reality.
111:3.6 Mind knows quantity, reality, meanings. But quality—values—is felt. That which feels is the mutual creation of mind, which knows, and the associated spirit, which reality-izes.
111:4.1 Recognition is the intellectual process of fitting the sensory impressions received from the external world into the memory patterns of the individual. Understanding connotes that these recognized sensory impressions and their associated memory patterns have become integrated or organized into a dynamic network of principles.
111:4.2 Meanings are derived from a combination of recognition and understanding. Meanings are nonexistent in a wholly sensory or material world. Meanings and values are only perceived in the inner or supermaterial spheres of human experience.
As for trusting a personality you don’t know and cannot interact with, I suppose you can choose to do that, but isn’t it better to trust a personality you do know and can interact with . . . Michael/Jesus/Spirit of Truth?
Certainly it is better, friend. Wherefore do you quibble? In response to your insinuations, I have not met or communicated with any of the authors and do not personally know them. I have only the words they have written, like everyone else. Are you suggesting we shouldn’t trust the authors? Do you suppose they came here with or without the knowledge of the Sovereign Master Son of Nebadon? I don’t think theirs was a mission undertaken without the authorization and approval of the head of the local universe government. I think Michael must have known about their advent and charged them to enlighten us with the truth. I think he must have trusted them to do this, which encourages me to trust them as well.
George, I think you misunderstand me. I am not quibbling with you or insinuating anything, let alone something nefarious. It’s sad that you don’t trust me, but then again, you don’t know me so it’s easy to be suspicious of my motives. That’s okay, but know that I’ll now be super careful answering your questions. I know you are not in contact with the authors of TUB. I brought that up for strictly rhetorical reasons. Don’t take offense. And of course Michael knows everything. It is his universe.
George wrote in 24438: I think Michael must have known about their advent and charged them to enlighten us with the truth. I think he must have trusted them to do this, which encourages me to trust them as well.
This is what I’ve been thinking for several years. Recall the Midwayers reported Jesus spent time (fraternized) with Morontia beings while still here; likely he talked to all personalities. He certainly could have expressed desire for them to help us! His love would have spread over all of them and they may have expressed their deep love for him, even perhaps extolled lavish praise for his brilliance and marvelous modeling. He may have given them clues or instruction about future revelation.
We do know the Midwayers were able to induce approval from planetary management for the FER. What influence on them would he have expressed while here in Morontia form? Its a great thought!
I think that what TUB does is redirect minds and souls wandering in the wilderness, directionless due to the lack of material teachers of truth. It is designed to bring the truth-seeking reader to utilize mind ministry as it is meant to be utilized. It’s nothing more than a pointer, a direction-corrector. The words in TUB are meaningless without the help of the Holy Spirit, Spirit of Truth and Adjuster. Spiritual insight is the only way to glean the truth from its words, and spiritual insight is a combined gift of the cosmic mind and the Adjuster. TUB is for those tired of wandering in the wilderness of ‘isms. It’s a real road map to the wisdom gateway and faith-bridge.
Bonita, I understand what you are attempting to present above, but it would seem that which I have highlighted in bold, would be true, however, would not these entities function differently, in regards to the individual whom they interact with? By this, I relate to the understanding and experience of that individual, whereby each person presents a different aspect to the “pointing” by which each “truth-seeking reader” may comprehend what might be points retained as a “direction-corrector”? If the “Holy Spirit, Spirit of Truth and Adjuster”, were to interact with every individual the same way, with the same points, then each individual would need to be the same, in order to obtain the same results but, since they are not, one could not hope to think that all individuals would understand the same way or believe and have faith, the same way.
Ramble= going from one place or subject to another with no clear direction or purpose.
i think you need to find a better word.
G’day all,
I am standing lately among the listener audience. Breaking my vows of silence to step in regarding post #24441 / MidiChlorian.
Dear brother, … why by heaven’s sake are you allowing yourself to stir down Bonita’s comment? Wouldn’t be more + uplifting as your eldest brother/Father show you, point out to enhance, praise your sister comment. May I need to remind you how « delicate » may be your relation specially when encounter on same thread? Why sadden her soul !!!
MidiChlorian regarding her post … Bonita expressed a sane, logic, not attempting or give a whirl out of proper context.
MidiChlorian excepting your pretending first line in your post … what you said was right and adequate.
146:02.13 Set watch on mouth Psalms 141:03 (Reference) “Set a watch, O Lord, before my mouth; keep the door of my lips.”
Brotherly concerns,
Lovingly concerns,
André
Dear brother, … why by heaven’s sake are you allowing yourself to stir down Bonita’s comment? Wouldn’t be more + uplifting as your eldest brother/Father show you, point out to enhance, praise your sister comment. May I need to remind you how « delicate » may be your relation specially when encounter on same thread? Why sadden her soul !!!
MidiChlorian regarding her post … Bonita expressed a sane, logic, not attempting or give a whirl out of proper context.
MidiChlorian excepting your pretending first line in your post … what you said was right and adequate.
André – I’m not sure where you are coming from or going to with your post but, my post regarding a portion Bonita’s previous posting was in the lines of additional questions, as were indicated by using “?” (question marks). Where I understand the premise that she had presented and I agree that the words read in TUB, are meaningless without the help of the entities she mentioned, whereby a reader, as an individual, would also be affected by their experiences or even learning from other text, which would indicate that these entities, being personal in nature to an individual or individuals, would reflect different results on that individual, regarding how or what they may believe and thereby also affecting their faith. Bonita has presented valid and logical information as she understands it to be, and I do not question her on these aspects of her presentation but, only wish to hear from her, as she might think other readers could comprehend those things which she presents, what “TUB does is redirect minds and souls”, “directionless due to the lack of material teachers of truth.” And for some, not all, this may be true, however, her statement that followed “Spiritual insight is the only way to glean the truth from its words,” which I also agree with in part, but would also depend on the individual, in that every individual situation is different and would not necessarily yield the same results.
Bonita has a enqueue way of looking at things and she is able to connect with others, however my query to her would be, how would her general presentation apply, more specifically, to certain individuals based on how they may respond to what is written in TUB or even more so, on this forum? She indicated that she thinks that she “rambles on”, where I do not see this to be the case, but rather mixing to much material together, where TUB groups material into subjects and topics, and others might benefit more if she individualized some of her material. I for one read her responses, and sometimes have difficulty in connecting all of it together, and would like more specific answers which I know that she will not respond to me because she has said that she and I are at odds, her words not mine.
Bradly wrote: I have witnessed little children (my own in peace and comfort but many in catastrophe and suffering including starvation, deprivation, starvation even) share, give comfort, serve, and sacrifice in selfless and self forgetting love and service to others, even to their own detriment and temporal threat. What the heck is THAT???!!!Another thing to consider here is the innate power of personality, which all by itself, has a morality-awareness when relating to other personalities. I actually don’t think morality exists without personality. Also, being of Paradise origin, I would think personality is naturally moral. According to quote 16:7.8, personality comes first followed by a growth in morality.
112:0.11 9. It [personality] is characterized by morality – awareness of relativity of relationship with other persons. It discerns conduct levels and choosingly discriminates between them.
16:7.8 From the standpoint of intelligence, man ascends to the level of a moral being because he is endowed with personality.
Andre, I don’t know who tagged your post as inappropriate, but I think whoever did that is acting inappropriately.
Thanks for your support by the way. So glad you broke your vow of silence. Wish you would contribute more!
I once posted 3 quotes only…and got “inappropriate” by some yayhoo. The mods need to monitor such claims and remove those which do not apply. Thanks Andre for speaking up in defense of friends.
The mods need to monitor such claims and remove those which do not apply.
And remove posters who behave inappropriately.
Speaking of mods, has anyone heard how Julian is doing? I think of him often and I’m still praying for him.
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