Question on The Tree of Life

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  • #34796
    Rick Warren
    Rick Warren
    Participant

    Perhaps we can infer what would have happened by looking at what actually happened. As stated above, the Nodites invaded the garden. They had heard, or at least we can infer that they had, that those who ate the tree would be immortal. Now let us, for the sake of argument, assume that Adam and Eve had been permited to take the tree. Based on what happened, can we infer what would have happened? They take the tree. They live long lives. The tree grows and becomes intangled in the folklore of A and Es’ decendants. They eat the fruit thinking, as the Nodites did, to become immortal. They fail as the Nodites did, but not before… Civil war in the family, perhaps after A and Es’ death… all over the tree? Just my thoughts

    I think all the Adamites in the Garden knew the Tree of Life held no benefit or effect for them any longer. Adam and Eve certainly would have. Even the Nodites came to know this fact and abandoned the myth.

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    It may be dead end speculation, but to explore the scenario a bit more, if, like Bonita pointed out, the tree was only an adjunct of their physical maintenance, not associated with the mind circuit that was disrupted upon default, then their bodies may have endured but their minds would have withered or failed eventually, no? We have to assume it was wise of the Receivers not to grant permission to move the tree… But that brings a not-so-speculative question: Did A&E ask permission to take it, and why would they?

    73:6.7 (826.4) When the plans of the Material Son went astray, Adam and his family were not permitted to carry the core of the tree away from the Garden.

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    #34797
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant

    Perhaps partaking of the tree of life would have allowed Adam and Eve to live in their earthly bodies indefinitely, like Van and Amadon. The question I have is why weren’t they allowed to do that, if only to maintain a center of culture on this planet until the next bestowal mission.  It seems logical to me, but then again, my logic has its flaws.  Maybe one of the reasons is that an adjunct to the tree of life is necessary.  Van and Amadon also had access to a specialized life ministry from the Melchizedeks in addition to the tree of life.  Perhaps two sources of life energy are necessary?  Don’t know.

    Van was left on Urantia until the time of Adam, remaining as titular head of all superhuman personalities functioning on the planet. He and Amadon were sustained by the technique of the tree of life in conjunction with the specialized life ministry of the Melchizedeks for over one hundred and fifty thousand years. 67:6.4

     

    #34798
    André
    André
    Participant

    Hi,

    Concerning physical indifinite perpetual status Van was constitued with life plasm from the 100 choosen descendants from Adon and Fonta. And attuned to the life circuits of the system.    66:2.6

    It worth to speculated “to be attuned”  might suggest their human corpse was adapted to respond to tree of life !

    In 66:2.6 we are told the rebellious sixty ” had been isolated from the life currents of the system.”

    Might be 2 differends  things mind’s gravity  and life  circuit of the system.

    Questions:

    How Amadon did  profit the “life currents of the  system ” ?

    Caligastia and Daligastia both secondary Lanonandek sons, after  rebellion, after the fault weren’t cut off,  ‘disjuncted’ of anything regarding petpetual longevity. Probably, because they were not material but  spiritual’s corpse. They didn’t have  to be substain with  mind’s gravity  or/and the tree of life.

    Why A&E were not authorized to keep going  God’s plans ? Could it be a  question of  trust ? Undoubtedly. Adam and Eve that default of trust culminated  in degradation of status. 75:7.6
    Could we included deviance of thinking?

    As you said  Rick  “disjonction” was a safeguard to any desobedience as reminded by  the archangel Solonia. Still in default, look how careless  ours parents were to follows directives from Solonia in 75:4.8.

    André

    #34799
    Rick Warren
    Rick Warren
    Participant

    Perhaps partaking of the tree of life would have allowed Adam and Eve to live in their earthly bodies indefinitely, like Van and Amadon. The question I have is why weren’t they allowed to do that, if only to maintain a center of culture on this planet until the next bestowal mission. It seems logical to me, but then again, my logic has its flaws. Maybe one of the reasons is that an adjunct to the tree of life is necessary. Van and Amadon also had access to a specialized life ministry from the Melchizedeks in addition to the tree of life. Perhaps two sources of life energy are necessary? Don’t know.

    Hi, Concerning physical indifinite perpetual status Van was constitued with life plasm from the 100 choosen descendants from Adon and Fonta. And attuned to the life circuits of the system. 66:2.6 It worth to speculated “to be attuned” might suggest their human corpse was adapted to respond to tree of life ! In 66:2.6 we are told the rebellious sixty ” had been isolated from the life currents of the system.” Might be 2 differends things mind’s gravity and life circuit of the system. Questions: How Amadon did profit the “life currents of the system ” ? Caligastia and Daligastia both secondary Lanonandek sons, after rebellion, after the fault weren’t cut off, ‘disjuncted’ of anything regarding petpetual longevity. Probably, because they were not material but spiritual’s corpse. They didn’t have to be substain with mind’s gravity or/and the tree of life. Why A&E were not authorized to keep going God’s plans ? Could it be a question of trust ? Undoubtedly. Adam and Eve that default of trust culminated in degradation of status. 75:7.6 Could we included deviance of thinking? As you said Rick “disjonction” was a safeguard to any desobedience as reminded by the archangel Solonia. Still in default, look how careless ours parents were to follows directives from Solonia in 75:4.8. André

    Glad not to be the only one with questions about the A&E bestowal, and its aftermath.

    Andre does offer an answer to Bonita’s question, suggesting irreparable broken trust is the reason A&E weren’t permitted to stay on. To me, her error seems so small and insignificant (maybe because we are virtually numb to error and sin) compared to the monumental consequences. Then Adam, following her lead, caused another error–which brought about Cain (and Abel’s murder) and precipitated the death of Laotta. And then they ended up impregnating 1200 women without benefit of marriage, not unlike Cano and Eve had planned. Interestingly, their error qualified them to sit on the Council of 24 overseers of Urantia.

    And then there’s that other question Bonita and I share, why was Urantia left without visible divinity for 30K years? So long did Urantia languish that an emergency bestowal had to precede Michael’s incarnation. Maybe the great gap in divine presence was to provide that more ‘striking backdrop’ for Michael’s bestowal… So many questions, but that doesn’t mean there aren’t answers, just a delay.

     

     

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    #34800
    Bradly
    Bradly
    Participant

    Urantia is so unusual on so many levels including the double whammy of rebellion and default.   We are told that Michael picked it for his final bestowal at the time of the Materials’ default.  Another peculiarity.  Are we the beneficiary of a different Plan B response as an experimental world?

    Perhaps the distribution of the violet blood was more important first prior to another Son?  The planetary epochal time frames are so long to us but not to our rulers.  I read something recently that makes me think the UB is not so unusual an advent or epochal revelation asI previously believed.

    Perhaps the internal mind ministries and gravity circuits are being put to the test?  Or we are blessed to be the perpetual source of Agondonters as well as The Shrine of Nebadon?  In any case I am confident myself and Urantia both benefit by the choices of our rulers.

     

    :good:

    #34801
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant

    Why A&E were not authorized to keep going  God’s plans ? Could it be a  question of  trust ? Undoubtedly. Adam and Eve that default of trust culminated  in degradation of status. 75:7.6 Could we included deviance of thinking?

    I like that.  After all, Eve did go against God’s will.  That’s a breach of trust for sure.  It’s also deviant thinking.  Anything that goes against the will of God is deviant.  But they were not guilty of contempt for truth, which I think speaks of motivation.  I think they never stopped wanting to serve God, just went about it wrongly, which is evil.

    What they had done was indeed evil, but they were never guilty of contempt for truth, . . . 75:7.7

    Adam and Eve’s degradation of status was to the mortal level, which meant they had to be treated like any other mortal, therefore no tree of life.  The tree of life is for supermortals and their associates, I think.  Also, Adam and Eve had dual circulations, so removing life sustaining energy from one circulatory system would undoubtedly have caused a severe chemical imbalance in their bodies even if they did have access to the tree of life for the other circulatory system.  Perhaps such an imbalance would have caused an even quicker death.  Just speculating here.

    And then there’s that other question Bonita and I share, why was Urantia left without visible divinity for 30K years? So long did Urantia languish that an emergency bestowal had to precede Michael’s incarnation. Maybe the great gap in divine presence was to provide that more ‘striking backdrop’ for Michael’s bestowal… So many questions, but that doesn’t mean there aren’t answers, just a delay.

    Perhaps it’s against God’s will to allow mere mortals to be examples of divinity.  Adam and Eve did have the benefit of prior life experience with divinity, but no longer had direct access to it for problem solving.  Even the Melchizedeks receivers wouldn’t advise them.

    When Adam learned that the Nodites were on the march, he sought the counsel of the Melchizedeks, but they refused to advise him, only telling him to do as he thought best and promising their friendly co-operation, as far as possible, in any course he might decide upon. The Melchizedeks had been forbidden to interfere with the personal plans of Adam and Eve. 75:6.1

    The Edenic pair were informed that they had degraded themselves to the status of the mortals of the realm; that they must henceforth conduct themselves as man and woman of Urantia, looking to the future of the world races for their future. 75:7.3

    I do admire their struggle, but it’s a shame that it all got tangled up in mythology and Lucifer-induced twisted ideation.  Rebels were still around to torture thought and influence behavior, unfortunately.  Without help, I don’t think Adam and Eve could have overcome them.

     

     

    #34802
    Rick Warren
    Rick Warren
    Participant

    …I do admire their struggle, but it’s a shame that it all got tangled up in mythology and Lucifer-induced twisted ideation…

    That’s why I’ve long wanted to write a corrective novel based on their lives as re-revealed in Papers 73-76. After Jesus’, their story is the most fascinating, maybe in all Nebadon. It’s in the editor’s hands now, should be out before year’s end. It was a real thrill to write, and I have an inkling of an idea how it will be received outside the U-community, but not inside. It seemed to have worked out well to have several women assist with the description of the meeting of Eve and Cano. Looking forward to feedback.

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    #34803
    Avatar
    Gene
    Participant

    “When Adam learned that the Nodites were on the march, he sought the counsel of the Melchizedeks, but they refused to advise him, only telling him to do as he thought best and promising their friendly co-operation, as far as possible, in any course he might decide upon. The Melchizedeks had been forbidden to interfere with the personal plans of Adam and Eve. 75:6.1”

    As humans, A&E likely needed some help with communications with Mel?

    #34804
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant

    As humans, A&E likely needed some help with communications with Mel?

    Apparently not.  Adam went to talk to Melchizedek to get advice.  That doesn’t sound like he needed help to me.  But it is interesting that Eve did loose contact with her husband when he was off those 30 days wandering around in despair.  Before her default she was able to be in contact with him for up to 50 miles, but that type of telepathy was cut off when she defaulted.  Maybe that was part of the mind circuit ministry she lost, don’t know.  But we are told that they were able to see and talk to celestial beings for 100 years after the default.

    Both the physical and spiritual visions of Adam and Eve were far superior to those of the present-day peoples. Their special senses were much more acute, and they were able to see the midwayers and the angelic hosts, the Melchizedeks, and the fallen Prince Caligastia, who several times came to confer with his noble successor. They retained the ability to see these celestial beings for over one hundred years after the default. These special senses were not so acutely present in their children and tended to diminish with each succeeding generation. 76:4.5

    Adam and Eve could communicate with each other and with their immediate children over a distance of about fifty miles. This thought exchange was effected by means of the delicate gas chambers located in close proximity to their brain structures. By this mechanism they could send and receive thought oscillations. But this power was instantly suspended upon the mind’s surrender to the discord and disruption of evil. 74:6.6

     

    #34806
    André
    André
    Participant

    Bonjour,

    Concerning suprahumans beings [100 staff member of planetary Prince] + Material Son and Daughter … Why the neccessity to be Though Adjuster free ?

    Any speculations arise when A&E were weighted spiritually regarding if suitable for mission on Urantia ?

    It is the plan of your superiors to advance you by augmented trusts just as fast as your character is sufficiently developed to gracefully bear these added responsibilities, but to overload the individual only courts disaster and insures disappointment. And the mistake of placing responsibility prematurely upon either man or angel may be avoided by utilizing the ministry of these infallible estimators of the trust capacity of the individuals of time and space. These seconaphim ever accompany Those High in Authority, and never do these executives make assignments until their candidates have been weighed in the secoraphic balances and pronounced “not wanting.”  28:6.15

    As it seems they were answerable as “to make weight”. Which weight, were they accountable to suit Urantia ?

    André

    #34807
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant

    Concerning suprahumans beings [100 staf member of planetary Prince] + Material Son and Daughter … Why the neccessity to be Though Adjuster free ?

    Because they’re already immortal?  I don’t think any of the descending Sons have Adjusters unless they begin the ascension career.  According to the quote below, Material Sons and Daughters need experience on a physical world before they gain capacity for an Adjuster and begin their ascension career.

    While living as permanent citizens on the system capitals, even when functioning on descending missions to the evolutionary planets, the Material Sons do not possess Thought Adjusters, but it is through these very services that they acquire experiential capacity for Adjuster indwellment and the Paradise ascension career. These unique and wonderfully useful beings are the connecting links between the spiritual and physical worlds. They are concentrated on the system headquarters, where they reproduce and carry on as material citizens of the realm, and whence they are dispatched to the evolutionary worlds. 51:1.6

    So I guess your question might be: what is it about service on an evolutionary planet that opens up the capacity for Adjuster indwelling?  I would guess it has something to do with providing new potentials for doing God’s will as part of the evolution of the Supreme. Just a guess though.

     

    #34808
    Rick Warren
    Rick Warren
    Participant

    …Why the neccessity to be Though Adjuster free ?

    And why weren’t Adam and Eve Adjustered long before coming to Urantia? Don’t know. But there must be a good reason(s).

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    #34809
    Rick Warren
    Rick Warren
    Participant

    Our posting timing is almost in sync, Bonita. I ask questions, you provided answers two minutes before the asking :good:

    Thanks for the Paper 51 quote.

    .

    …While living as permanent citizens on the system capitals, even when functioning on descending missions to the evolutionary planets, the Material Sons do not possess Thought Adjusters, but it is through these very services that they acquire experiential capacity for Adjuster indwellment and the Paradise ascension career. These unique and wonderfully useful beings are the connecting links between the spiritual and physical worlds. They are concentrated on the system headquarters, where they reproduce and carry on as material citizens of the realm, and whence they are dispatched to the evolutionary worlds. 51:1.6

    #34810
    André
    André
    Participant

    Hi,

    Melchizedek was immortal and his corpse was of same composition as the 100 [93:2.6] but him was granted a T/A [93:2.7]  !!!

    Ok, I understand T/A is exclusive to ascending humans beings … so why detached it from the 100?

    mumbling/mumbling/mumbling

    André

    p.s. … just thinking out loud

     

    #34811
    André
    André
    Participant

    Again,

    Because they’re already immortal?

    So, if the 100 are rendered immortal … thats means they fusioned with T/A then it itsn’t a particularity they became indissociable ?

    There is something regarding the 100, Machiventa and Jesus [cede to a optimum efficiency for incarnation].

    Give it up or give it in ?

    André

     

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