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…. or does it?
I ask myself this question after reading TUB’s account on Paul’s TA making a projection to the third Mansion world. Here are the scriptures in question:
TUB: “When the apostle spoke of being “caught up to the third heaven,” he referred to that experience in which his Adjuster was detached during sleep and in this unusual state made a projection to the third of the seven mansion worlds.”
KVB: “I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven.”
Thought Adjusters descend from Father to indwell the mind of man, according to what we are told. How did Paul mistaken his TA experience for his own? Or what happened in that projection perhaps could be likened to the feeling one has upon waking from a dream; that being, the feeling of an “observer” of one’s self ; or experiencing a dream from a third person point of view.
Does TUB tell us experiences of TA, particularly when on detached assignments, become the possession of its human host during indwelling? I do not recall.
BB
Thought Adjusters descend from Father to indwell the mind of man, according to what we are told. How did Paul mistaken his TA experience for his own? Or what happened in that projection perhaps could be likened to the feeling one has upon waking from a dream; that being, the feeling of an “observer” of one’s self ; or experiencing a dream from a third person point of view.
I’m not sure that Paul was mistaking “his TA experience for his own”, because if you read “2 Corinthians Chapter 12” in its entirety you may see that Paul was speaking in a round about way as to not come right out and say that the TA was most active in him, where as he projects his experience back to his conversion on the road and lead him into Damascus, but in these verses he is attempting to express his experience which he would not be able to verify to others who were listening, if they had not experienced something like this for themselves. In the following verses he states:
5 Of such an one will I glory: yet of myself I will not glory, but in mine infirmities.
6 For though I would desire to glory, I shall not be a fool; for I will say the truth: but now I forbear, lest any man should think of me above that which he seeth me to be, or that he heareth of me.
7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.
8 For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me.
Where he first did not wish to look like a fool, and that those revelations which he was receiving from his TA, which he realized as being above him in that “Of such an one will I glory”, or glorify, but making sure to not give the impression that because, he was aware that the TA was inside of him, made sure to “yet of myself I will not glory,” or glorify, even “For though I would desire to glory”.
Even to the point that Paul even asked that these “voices” or thoughts from the TA, “that it might depart from me” – him, where he thought that the TA’s messages, if not arranged in such a way that many would consider him the “messenger of Satan”, especially if others thought him above the TA. Therefore it would seem that he was fully aware of the TA but had to take control of himself to keep from being overtaken by the spirit within.
Thought Adjusters descend from Father to indwell the mind of man, according to what we are told. How did Paul mistaken his TA experience for his own? Or what happened in that projection perhaps could be likened to the feeling one has upon waking from a dream; that being, the feeling of an “observer” of one’s self ; or experiencing a dream from a third person point of view.
I’m not sure that Paul was mistaking “his TA experience for his own”, because if you read “2 Corinthians Chapter 12″ in its entirety you may see that Paul was speaking in a round about way as to not come right out and say that the TA was most active in him, where as he projects his experience back to his conversion on the road and lead him into Damascus, but in these verses he is attempting to express his experience which he would not be able to verify to others who were listening, if they had not experienced something like this for themselves. In the following verses he states:
5 Of such an one will I glory: yet of myself I will not glory, but in mine infirmities. 6 For though I would desire to glory, I shall not be a fool; for I will say the truth: but now I forbear, lest any man should think of me above that which he seeth me to be, or that he heareth of me. 7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure. 8 For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me.
Where he first did not wish to look like a fool, and that those revelations which he was receiving from his TA, which he realized as being above him in that “Of such an one will I glory”, or glorify, but making sure to not give the impression that because, he was aware that the TA was inside of him, made sure to “yet of myself I will not glory,” or glorify, even “For though I would desire to glory”. Even to the point that Paul even asked that these “voices” or thoughts from the TA, “that it might depart from me” – him, where he thought that the TA’s messages, if not arranged in such a way that many would consider him the “messenger of Satan”, especially if others thought him above the TA. Therefore it would seem that he was fully aware of the TA but had to take control of himself to keep from being overtaken by the spirit within.
So, when Paul says: “of such a one” he is referring to his TA if I understand correctly what you are saying.
BB
So, when Paul says: “of such a one” he is referring to his TA if I understand correctly what you are saying.
Yes, and No, where the UB is indicating that Paul had a personalized Adjuster but he would not actually acknowledge this as an Adjuster but a voice from within, where it would be validated from Saul/Paul, that this voice or TA was Jesus, where it could be considered that this personalized TA to Paul could have been the TA who resided with Jesus, having taken on the experience from the time with Jesus, or Jesus Himself. Having while in the flesh with Jesus, been subject to the Jews and now being with Paul, being able to administer to the Gentiles the message of the Kingdom within. Where it was told in Acts Chapter 9, and 22, where in 9:15, Saul “is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles,” therefore prior to Pentecost, TA’s were not automatically bestowed, but in this case was personalized to Saul, for his conversion. From that point on, became Paul after his Baptism. Some might think that this Spirit was the Spirit of Truth, but I think not, because Paul’s life from that point had taken total opposite direction.
From Acts, Chapter 9:
3 And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven:
4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?
5 And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.
6 And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do.
7 And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless, hearing a voice, but seeing no man.
8 And Saul arose from the earth; and when his eyes were opened, he saw no man: but they led him by the hand, and brought him into Damascus.
9 And he was three days without sight, and neither did eat nor drink.
10 And there was a certain disciple at Damascus, named Ananias; and to him said the Lord in a vision, Ananias. And he said, Behold, I am here, Lord.
11 And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the street which is called Straight, and enquire in the house of Judas for one called Saul, of Tarsus: for, behold, he prayeth,
12 And hath seen in a vision a man named Ananias coming in, and putting his hand on him, that he might receive his sight.
13 Then Ananias answered, Lord, I have heard by many of this man, how much evil he hath done to thy saints at Jerusalem:
14 And here he hath authority from the chief priests to bind all that call on thy name.
15 But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:
16 For I will shew him how great things he must suffer for my name’s sake.
From Acts 22:
6 And it came to pass, that, as I made my journey, and was come nigh unto Damascus about noon, suddenly there shone from heaven a great light round about me.
7 And I fell unto the ground, and heard a voice saying unto me, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?
8 And I answered, Who art thou, Lord? And he said unto me, I am Jesus of Nazareth, whom thou persecutest.
9 And they that were with me saw indeed the light, and were afraid; but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me.
10 And I said, What shall I do, Lord? And the Lord said unto me, Arise, and go into Damascus; and there it shall be told thee of all things which are appointed for thee to do.
11 And when I could not see for the glory of that light, being led by the hand of them that were with me, I came into Damascus.
12 And one Ananias, a devout man according to the law, having a good report of all the Jews which dwelt there,
13 Came unto me, and stood, and said unto me, Brother Saul, receive thy sight. And the same hour I looked up upon him.
14 And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth.
15 For thou shalt be his witness unto all men of what thou hast seen and heard.
The only contradiction between these two Chapters is where it is noted that those with Saul, heard not the voice but in the other it states that they heard a voice, but this might have not been the same message that Saul heard, or subjective after the story was retold by Paul? Then again the voice which those who lead Saul into Damascus may have only heard a voice which instructed them to take Saul into Damascus and not heard the other things which Saul heard.
Where does this notion that Personalized Adjusters can indwell humans come from? It’s not supported anywhere in the UB. And the idea that Jesus’ Personalized Adjuster indwelled Paul is simply not possible. Adjusters either attain fusion personality with a mortal or they have a personality bestowed or conferred upon them by the Universal Father of personality. Once personality is attained, an Adjuster no longer needs to indwell anyone, nor could he. Personalities are unique. To have two personalities in one body is not possible. Note in the following quote that Personalized Adjusters are unassigned.109:7.2 Personalized Thought Adjusters are the untrammeled, unassigned, and sovereign stabilizers and compensators of the far-flung universe of universes.Jesus’ Adjuster previously indwelled Machiventa Melchizedek, but he was not personalized at the time of either indwelling. It wasn’t until Jesus’ baptism that his Adjuster became personalized, receiving his very own unique personality. Now, and at the time of Paul, this Personalized Adjuster has been the director all of the Adjusters present on this planet and “. . . chief of his kind throughout the entire local universe of Nebadon”(136:2.3). Jesus’ Personalized Adjuster cannot be chief of Adjusters and also indwell another human being. And although Personalized Adjusters might serve other Adjusters, we are not permitted to know anything of their other ministries. So anyone claiming to know that Personalized Adjusters indwell humans is also claiming to know something we are not permitted to know. Which makes such a thing extremely suspect.109:7.8 Personalized Adjusters perform a wide range of services for numerous orders of universe personalities, but we are not permitted to discuss these ministries with Adjuster-indwelt evolutionary creatures.Furthermore, once Adjusters become personalized, they no longer function in time. In order for a Personalized Adjuster to indwell a human being within time he would have to become time-limited. Not possible.136:5.4 . . . Adjusters are nontime beings when once they are personalized.
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