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For over two decades, continually, I experienced (and still do) a paranormal called “astral projection.” At first, during the initial phase of studying TUB, I attributed the experience to TA detachment or, what I reasoned at the time as, “temporal fusion.” I now suspect there could be other phenomenon at play. Presently I am studying revelations on ‘mind,’ its many facets and abilities as they are presented by the authors. Can mind, ie, consciousness or unconsciousness, detach and project itself during mortal existence? When people astral project, besides TA could it be the mind moving through circuits that they are experiencing?
“… God is the source of truth in the mind spheres.”
“… individual experience of the progressive struggles of the expanding minds and the ascending spirits of every entity, being, and personality of the whole evolutionary creation of time and space. And all this is literally true, for “in Him we all live and move and have our being.”
“… and though my order of personality can traverse the mind circuits of the Conjoint Actor also beyond the confines of the grand universe.”
I would like to know your thoughts so please share. Thanks.
BB
Interesting thought.
From paper#6 The Spirit Mind:
Mortal man preceives mind on the finite, cosmic, material and personal levels.
Man also observes mind phenomena in living organisms functioning on the animal level, but it is difficult for him to grasp the nature of mind when associated with super material beings and as a part of exclusive spirit personalities. Mind must be differently defined when it refers to the spirit level of existence and when it is used to denote spirit functions of intelligence.
My thoughts are that mortal man’s reception of any of the minds denoted above does not imply detachment. I also see that the author states it is difficult to grasp mind of super material beings, he did not say it is impossible, just difficult.
Finite, cosmic, material or personal mind need not in my opinion require detachment for perception. Maybe we may feel detached when this happens and I have no idea if this feeling is real or imagined. I believe that somewhere in this book we are told that our minds are very closely tied to and restricted by the material.
What about pre-mind? Not mentioned but some sort of vehicle for contact must be available otherwise the TA would be out of a job. TA mind is not connected with any of the Conjoint Actor mind circuits and it is a fragment of the Father.
I would be gratified if I could define and be confident that I knew what mind I had contact with at any particular time.
Interesting thought. From paper#6 The Spirit Mind: Mortal man preceives mind on the finite, cosmic, material and personal levels. Man also observes mind phenomena in living organisms functioning on the animal level, but it is difficult for him to grasp the nature of mind when associated with super material beings and as a part of exclusive spirit personalities. Mind must be differently defined when it refers to the spirit level of existence and when it is used to denote spirit functions of intelligence. My thoughts are that mortal man’s reception of any of the minds denoted above does not imply detachment. I also see that the author states it is difficult to grasp mind of super material beings, he did not say it is impossible, just difficult. Finite, cosmic, material or personal mind need not in my opinion require detachment for perception. Maybe we may feel detached when this happens and I have no idea if this feeling is real or imagined. I believe that somewhere in this book we are told that our minds are very closely tied to and restricted by the material. What about pre-mind? Not mentioned but some sort of vehicle for contact must be available otherwise the TA would be out of a job. TA mind is not connected with any of the Conjoint Actor mind circuits and it is a fragment of the Father. I would be gratified if I could define and be confident that I knew what mind I had contact with at any particular time.
Interesting thoughts on the subject! thanks for sharing, Nelsong. “Detach” does seem an inaccurate word. One TUB scripture describes the super intelligent mind as “expanding” (1:5.16). It could be what people experience, besides TA detachment, during lucid dreaming or astral projecting is mind expansion, penetrating those circuits or planes beyond the material world. During those altered sleep states, could it be that a fully activated seven adjutant mind ministry with the two higher ones exerting the strongest influence is allowing them to expand their consciousness into the Midwayer’s life-functioning plane of existence?
I read the following references and thought that they might have some bearing on this discussion:
“Most of the inhabited worlds of Nebadon harbor one or more groups of unique beings existing on a life-functioning level about midway between those of the mortals of the realms and of the angelic orders; hence are they called midway creatures.”
“Adjutant-spirit minds. This is the ministry of a local universe Mother Spirit functioning through her seven adjutant mind-spirits on the teachable (nonmechanical) level of material mind. On this level material mind is experiencing: as subhuman (animal) intellect in the first five adjutants; as human (moral) intellect in the seven adjutants; as superhuman (midwayer) intellect in the last two adjutants.”
BB
For over two decades, continually, I experienced (and still do) a paranormal called “astral projection.” At first, during the initial phase of studying TUB, I attributed the experience to TA detachment or, what I reasoned at the time as, “temporal fusion.” I now suspect there could be other phenomenon at play. Presently I am studying revelations on ‘mind,’ its many facets and abilities as they are presented by the authors. Can mind, ie, consciousness or unconsciousness, detach and project itself during mortal existence? When people astral project, besides TA could it be the mind moving through circuits that they are experiencing?
B.B., I’m not sure as to your use of the phrase “temporal fusion” where are you associating the adjective “temporal” as “pertaining to time”, or “enduring for a time only; temporary; transitory”, in that “fusion” would imply a more permanent state? Also, I am assuming that the previous phrase is related to your experiencing “astral projection” as you put it, which would not necessarily include a distortion of time, where it would imply movement in relative space within time, where time is constant and projected location is detached. Although, this paranormal phenomena, might be difficult to ascertain from the perspective of mind only, in that it is mostly a subjective type of experience.
I have in the past experienced what might or could be a similar experience, not so much currently, but this I contribute to having been tested through EEG, that I can reach REM Sleep while conscious, or in a meditative state, where I am aware of my immediate surroundings which were none visual, or with my eye’s closed, while in this state. Being able to mentally visualize and hear different surrounding, but not able to ascertain the actual location but able to identify what I heard or hear specifically if it involved music in the background. At one time I thought that I was attached to someone else’s dream in that I was able to interact in the environment but I was not recognized by others but able to move within a limited area as if I was able to look around. This experience also, was in a similar state as mentioned before, but this time I know the general area but had never been there, so I could not recognize the area from memory, or having been there in the past. The odd thing was that at a given time through this experience the motion stopped and even through I was still in the visual frame, there was no addition interaction, so I opened my eyes to validate that I was actually awake, because I don’t dream, or if I do I cannot remember dreaming, so I assume that I do not.
I’m wondering if your experience is similar, although not necessarily pertinent to the discussion? However, I cannot determine if by your wording of the topic title, that it is less that the mind detaches from personality but rather that if an individual has been directly associated with their Thought Adjuster or Spiritual fused with their Adjuster, could a self acting or superacting Adjuster, when detached from this individual also reflect back this experience to that personality where the individuals consciousness could pick up on this as a joint experience.
The UB does indicate that the human physiology or mechanism could be subject to specific channels.
(84.4) 7:3.4 The discriminative operation of the spirit-gravity circuit might possibly be compared to the functions of the neural circuits in the material human body: Sensations travel inward over the neural paths; some are detained and responded to by the lower automatic spinal centers; others pass on to the less automatic but habit-trained centers of the lower brain, while the most important and vital incoming messages flash by these subordinate centers and are immediately registered in the highest levels of human consciousness.
nelsong wrote: . . . but it is difficult for him to grasp the nature of mind when associated with super material beings and as a part of exclusive spirit personalities.How does your claim match up with this quote:
p1123:1 102:4.1 Because of the presence in your minds of the thought adjuster, it is no more of a mystery for you to know the mind of God than for you to be sure of the consciousness of knowing any other mind, human or superhuman.
During those altered sleep states, could it be that a fully activated seven adjutant mind ministry with the two higher ones exerting the strongest influence is allowing them to expand their consciousness into the Midwayer’s life-functioning plane of existence?
What you’ve failed to consider is the presence of the soul. The Adjuster and the soul are intimately connected until that time when death temporarily separates them, or some other special situation occurs such as joining the Planetary Prince’s staff. If the Adjuster detaches during sleep, he takes the soul with him (111:3.2; 48:6.2). The Adjuster detaches from the personality and the material mind, but not from the soul. The two are integrated and do not separate randomly. The awareness of the detached event by the mortal mind is entirely dependent upon the given mortal’s level of soul consciousness and personality identification with the soul. There comes a point in soul growth where the soul becomes conscious of the supermaterial activities of the Adjusters (5:2.5), and from its conception, the soul is capable of super mortal function (48:6.2).
For instance, Paul’s memory of the “third heaven” occurred because his soul was actually there with his Adjuster, as were the other visionary wise men mentioned in the same quote. Since Paul had presumably reached a level of soul consciousness, his material mind became aware of the experience. Recall that only self-acting or supreme Adjusters are capable of detaching (109:2.10). Anyone who has entered the third psychic circle or is a member of the Reserve Corps, has a self-acting Adjuster (110:6.22), and I assume Paul had achieved this psychic circle. However, the meaning of the experience with the Adjuster and the ability to describe or explain the experience is entirely limited by the material mind, which is totally inadequate for the job. Hence the use of symbolism and metaphor when describing these things, which is why they seem so “visionary”, mystical and unearthly.
112:6.7 The self-consciousness of the human adjutant mind is independent of Adjuster presence. The soul, being superadjutant requires the presence of the Adjuster for self-consciousness when deprived of the material mind.
nelsong wrote: . . . but it is difficult for him to grasp the nature of mind when associated with super material beings and as a part of exclusive spirit personalities.
How does your claim match up with this quote:p1123:1 102:4.1 Because of the presence in your minds of the thought adjuster, it is no more of a mystery for you to know the mind of God than for you to be sure of the consciousness of knowing any other mind, human or superhuman.
My guess is that all of the different minds have one thing in common – the ability to know and be known. Even the pre-mind of the Adjuster.
The nature of these diverse minds is a different story and implies understanding, especially when associated with diverse personalities???
What you’ve failed to consider is the presence of the soul. The Adjuster and the soul are intimately connected until that time when death temporarily separates them, or some other special situation occurs such as joining the Planetary Prince’s staff. If the Adjuster detaches during sleep, he takes the soul with him (111:3.2; 48:6.2). The Adjuster detaches from the personality and the material mind, but not from the soul. The two are integrated and do not separate randomly. The awareness of the detached event by the mortal mind is entirely dependent upon the given mortal’s level of soul consciousness and personality identification with the soul. There comes a point in soul growth where the soul becomes conscious of the supermaterial activities of the Adjusters (5:2.5), and from its conception, the soul is capable of super mortal function (48:6.2). For instance, Paul’s memory of the “third heaven” occurred because his soul was actually there with his Adjuster, as were the other visionary wise men mentioned in the same quote. Since Paul had presumably reached a level of soul consciousness, his material mind became aware of the experience. Recall that only self-acting or supreme Adjusters are capable of detaching (109:2.10). Anyone who has entered the third psychic circle or is a member of the Reserve Corps, has a self-acting Adjuster (110:6.22), and I assume Paul had achieved this psychic circle. However, the meaning of the experience with the Adjuster and the ability to describe or explain the experience is entirely limited by the material mind, which is totally inadequate for the job. Hence the use of symbolism and metaphor when describing these things, which is why they seem so “visionary”, mystical and unearthly. 112:6.7 The self-consciousness of the human adjutant mind is independent of Adjuster presence. The soul, being superadjutant requires the presence of the Adjuster for self-consciousness when deprived of the material mind.Those are really good references you provided. Clears the matter up for me. Thanks! So in essence mind cannot travel like soul and TA. So what happens to our consciousness when TA and soul detach? Do we become something other than self? or does that event render us in an unconscious state? or is it something else?
BB
Brooklyn_born wrote: So what happens to our consciousness when TA and soul detach? Do we become something other than self? or does that event render us in an unconscious state? or is it something else?The Midwayers babysit and assure the integrity of the mortal mind and personality in the absence of the Adjuster.
77:7.5 This was accomplished in much the same way as the loyal midway creatures function when they serve as efficient contact guardians of the human minds of the Urantia reserve corps of destiny at those times when the Adjuster is, in effect, detached from the personality during a season of contact with superhuman intelligences.
Remember that even Jesus needed to have his mind and personality vouchsafed by Immanuel before the arrival of his Adjuster:
120:2.9 Prior to the arrival and reception of the Adjuster I will vouch for your personality integrity.
Remember too that the mortal mind can function quite independent of the Adjuster and the soul. Upon soul death, the material mind keeps right on going.
112:6.7 Mortal mind, prior to death, is self-consciously independent of the Adjuster presence; adjutant mind needs only the associated material-energy pattern to enable it to operate.
112:3.2 This kind of death is final in its significance irrespective of the temporary continuation of the living energies of the physical and mind mechanisms. From the cosmic standpoint the mortal is already dead; the continuing life merely indicates the persistence of the material momentum of cosmic energies.
Brooklyn_born wrote: So what happens to our consciousness when TA and soul detach? Do we become something other than self? or does that event render us in an unconscious state? or is it something else?The Midwayers babysit and assure the integrity of the mortal mind and personality in the absence of the Adjuster.
77:7.5 This was accomplished in much the same way as the loyal midway creatures function when they serve as efficient contact guardians of the human minds of the Urantia reserve corps of destiny at those times when the Adjuster is, in effect, detached from the personality during a season of contact with superhuman intelligences.
Remember that even Jesus needed to have his mind and personality vouchsafed by Immanuel before the arrival of his Adjuster:
120:2.9 Prior to the arrival and reception of the Adjuster I will vouch for your personality integrity.
Remember too that the mortal mind can function quite independent of the Adjuster and the soul. Upon soul death, the material mind keeps right on going.
112:6.7 Mortal mind, prior to death, is self-consciously independent of the Adjuster presence; adjutant mind needs only the associated material-energy pattern to enable it to operate. 112:3.2 This kind of death is final in its significance irrespective of the temporary continuation of the living energies of the physical and mind mechanisms. From the cosmic standpoint the mortal is already dead; the continuing life merely indicates the persistence of the material momentum of cosmic energies.
The ideas you present line up perfectly with those references. Thanks for the explanation.
BB
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