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…Aren’t we contributing constructively through our discussion here? Applied philosophy in unity with religious experience of our brotherhood. But then if we want to reach others not familiar with the term ‘philosophy’ we would be starting with accepted conceptions of happiness using pointed questions as Socrates did, I think. I am not particularly interested in Facebook, but follow my daughter’s posts and I see appreciation for beauty in nature posted regularly. A common consideration is whether this is intelligent design or evolution. Society uses philosophical discussion a lot as you said earlier, Rick. Why not tell them they are natural philosophers?
Excellent points, and yes, no doubt people can become comfortable with the word philosophy when they realize we are all philosophers–in a measure at least. So let’s tell ’em the truthfacts
.I led my daughter into this discussion years ago by calling her a natural philosopher. She was quite young, so she innocently and predictably asked ‘What do they do?” Thinking she might be one. — So began a very long drawn out conversation lasting years. But it was always fun because we would critique something done or said. It began when we were discussing jobs. She said “I would rather do something I love doing, than something I am good at.”
Smart daughter. Savvy mom. Both good philosophers sounds like.
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Richard E Warren
Good philosophers? LOL I have a love of philosophy, but until recently this has only been “metaphysics”. When I discovered the Urantia Book (one year ago) I realised how little we really know. This forum has brought my ponderings to new heights . It was two weeks of reading here before I felt confident to post — so nice to embark on the journey in this distinguished company. It is exciting and really quite funny to think that all us ‘philosophers’ have a wonderful eternity ahead feeding that love of philosophy — as has everyone! If only they knew.
I have been reassessing my approach to personal religious experience. I am now wondering whether it lends itself to discussion. Take worship for example — we do not wake up thinking what will I focus my worship on today? Worship is an unthinking act, unconscious at times but always automatic. I think that the same goes for most, if not all religious experience. The experience of identifying with the personalised adjuster within is not a process we can force. As we become more God-conscious and searching — goodness just happens. I am grateful for a general understanding of the individualised nature of personal religious experience. It seems appropriate to leave it at that to develop naturally without misappropriation or scrutiny.
2:6.1 (40.5) …”the goodness of God is found only in the spiritual world of personal religious experience.”
The more closely man approaches God through love, the greater the reality — actuality — of that man. 117:4.14 (1285.3)
Angela – I am so glad you found this place and may you always feel welcome here. The more the merrier!! I find this forum most illuminating by the sharing and the caring of the students and student teachers who attend and work together to harmonize the many facts of universe reality with the truths of personal experience in the spirit. As you say – so much to learn!! And do!! What an adventure!!
The approach to our personal religious experience is the very foundation of philosophy and one of the most impressive functions of the Urantia Papers I think….context for perspective including the assets/resources to help us and an itemized list of obstacles – the mind poisons and the material nature. What a guidebook to both the inner life and the reality of the universe of universes and the relationship of the each to the all and the all to the each and the each to one another.
While there are most definitely stupid answers, the sincere student simply cannot ask stupid questions. I hope you find your time here rewarding and feel comfortable in expressing yourself by question, proposition, reflection, and the sharing of your experience in the text and in the life of cosmic citizen!! For myself, I claim the high status of tadpole….on the pilgrim’s path to finaliter and the eternal adventure! Again, welcome to the fun.
Angela wrote: Does anyone have ideas on what the whole of religious experience encompasses?I propose that the whole of religious experience encompasses everything:
117:6.9 Men all too often forget that God is the greatest experience in human existence. Other experiences are limited in their nature and content, but the experience of God has no limits save those of the creature’s comprehension capacity, and this very experience is in itself capacity enlarging. When men search for God, they are searching for everything. When they find God, they have found everything. The search for God is the unstinted bestowal of love attended by amazing discoveries of new and greater love to be bestowed.
Angela wrote: I hear what you are saying. Personal religious experience is “personal” and cannot influence larger societal conditions.Are you referring to something I said? I don’t think I ever said that personal religious experience cannot influence society. Quite the opposite. Personal religious experience has no other option but to influence society. If one’s personal religious experience is real, it will overflow into society as fruits of the spirit. If it’s unreal, it will not accomplish anything. It’s the fruits that do the influencing, and not social fruit, only spiritual fruit.
The first responsibility of any religionist is to align him/herself with God and then dedicate their life to doing his will. And his will is always outgoing, always sharing, always giving and loving, always going the second mile and the third. If you want to change society, you have to first change your own orientation and direction of identity through personal religious experience, then make contact with society and go the second mile.
5:4.3 God is not only the determiner of destiny; he is man’s eternal destination. All nonreligious human activities seek to bend the universe to the distorting service of self; the truly religious individual seeks to identify the self with the universe and then to dedicate the activities of this unified self to the service of the universe family of fellow beings, human and superhuman.
16:9.8 Unselfish social consciousness must be, at bottom, a religious consciousness; that is, if it is objective; otherwise it is a purely subjective philosophic abstraction and therefore devoid of love. Only a God-knowing individual can love another person as he loves himself.
16:7.9 Morality can never be advanced by law or by force. It is a personal and freewill matter and must be disseminated by the contagion of the contact of morally fragrant persons with those who are less morally responsive, but who are also in some measure desirous of doing the Father’s will.
102:3.4 Religious desire is the hunger quest for divine reality. Religious experience is the realization of the consciousness of having found God. And when a human being does find God, there is experienced within the soul of that being such an indescribable restlessness of triumph in discovery that he is impelled to seek loving service-contact with his less illuminated fellows, not to disclose that he has found God, but rather to allow the overflow of the welling-up of eternal goodness within his own soul to refresh and ennoble his fellows. Real religion leads to increased social service.
195:10.5 In winning souls for the Master, it is not the first mile of compulsion, duty, or convention that will transform man and his world, but rather the second mile of free service and liberty-loving devotion that betokens the Jesusonian reaching forth to grasp his brother in love and sweep him on under spiritual guidance toward the higher and divine goal of mortal existence. Christianity even now willingly goes the first mile, but mankind languishes and stumbles along in moral darkness because there are so few genuine second-milers — so few professed followers of Jesus who really live and love as he taught his disciples to live and love and serve.
I hope you find your time here rewarding and feel comfortable in expressing yourself by question, proposition, reflection, and the sharing of your experience in the text and in the life of cosmic citizen!! For myself, I claim the high status of tadpole….on the pilgrim’s path to finaliter and the eternal adventure! Again, welcome to the fun.
Bradly, many thanks for your kind words. So grateful for the guidance gathered here and at the old site. I could not have imagined the peace, assurance and happiness I would gain reading TUB. The life of the cosmic citizen is the best!
100:4.3 (1097.7) ”But the great problem of religious living consists in the task of unifying the soul powers of the personality by the dominance of LOVE. Health, mental efficiency, and happiness arise from the unification of physical systems, mind systems, and spirit systems. Of health and sanity man understands much, but of happiness he has truly realized very little. The highest happiness is indissolubly linked with spiritual progress. Spiritual growth yields lasting joy, peace which passes all understanding.”
Bonita, grateful for your amazing insight. That first quote you use is beautiful, really.
117:6.9 …The search for God is the unstinted bestowal of love attended by amazing discoveries of new and greater love to be bestowed.
The more closely man approaches God through love, the greater the reality — actuality — of that man. 117:4.14 (1285.3)
Angela wrote: Does anyone have ideas on what the whole of religious experience encompasses?I propose that the whole of religious experience encompasses everything:
117:6.9 Men all too often forget that God is the greatest experience in human existence. Other experiences are limited in their nature and content, but the experience of God has no limits save those of the creature’s comprehension capacity, and this very experience is in itself capacity enlarging. When men search for God, they are searching for everything. When they find God, they have found everything. The search for God is the unstinted bestowal of love attended by amazing discoveries of new and greater love to be bestowed.
Yes, agreed. Perhaps I should have narrowed my question to: Does anyone have ideas on what personal religious experience on Urantia encompasses?
But here is the really interesting part. After investigating the experiential Deity, the Supreme Being, and finding that ‘everything’ really does mean everything, I then looked at what a Personality would contribute to the experiential Deity. After adjuster fusion and finaliter transcendation the experiential contribution of Urantia finaliters will be those personal decisions which have been illuminated by “sincere worship, glorified by intelligent love, and consummated in brotherly service.”
117:5.3 (1286.1) The evolving immortal soul of man, the joint creation of the material mind and the Adjuster, ascends as such to Paradise and subsequently, when mustered into the Corps of the Finality, becomes allied in some new way with the spirit-gravity circuit of the Eternal Son by a technique of experience known as finaliter transcendation. Such finaliters thus become acceptable candidates for experiential recognition as personalities of God the Supreme. And when these mortal intellects in the unrevealed future assignments of the Corps of the Finality attain the seventh stage of spirit existence, such dual minds will become triune. These two attuned minds, the human and the divine, will become glorified in union with the experiential mind of the then actualized Supreme Being.
117:5.13 (1287.4) What man himself takes with him as a personality possession are the character consequences of the experience of having used the mind and spirit circuits of the grand universe in his Paradise ascent. When man decides, and when he consummates this decision in action, man experiences, and the meanings and the values of this experience are forever a part of his eternal character on all levels, from the finite to the final. Cosmically moral and divinely spiritual character represents the creature’s capital accumulation of personal decisions which have been illuminated by sincere worship, glorified by intelligent love, and consummated in brotherly service.
The more closely man approaches God through love, the greater the reality — actuality — of that man. 117:4.14 (1285.3)
Angela wrote: Does anyone have ideas on what personal religious experience on Urantia encompasses?We had a discussion about this once before. I think it was on the old, old forum though. It was started by Rick and was about genuine religious experience (GRE), or something like that. Can’t remember. I think you should start a new topic on this because it is not really philosophy. It’s religion. Either way, I’d be happy to discuss it again.
That one is from 2009. Yes, the old, old: http://urantia.invisionzone.com/index.php?/topic/703-the-ub-on-genuine-and-personal-religious-experiences/
Richard E Warren
I eagerly read all 4 pages on genuine and personal religious experiences on link you provided. Thanks Bonita and Rick, very helpful.
I have taken your advice, Bonita and started a new topic continuing on with the same name — “The UB on Genuine and Personal Religious Experience”.
The more closely man approaches God through love, the greater the reality — actuality — of that man. 117:4.14 (1285.3)
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