Suffering

Viewing 15 posts - 61 through 75 (of 93 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #28040
    Bradly
    Bradly
    Participant

    Thanks  Bonita…..As I recall being born of/in the Spirit is the arrival of TA and birth of soul.  Being born again or reborn in the Spirit is, according to my research, only found in Part IV in the words spoken by Jesus (or quotes of his in Part III).  This, to me, has meant a conscious choice to embrace the spirit nature within of our two dual nature selves – material and spirit.  I think you describe an inner response to the Spirit which grows gradually and certainly with a certain personal acceptance of the reality of the Spirit nature and personal response to the Spirit within that does not actually require a moment of sanctification for the birth of religion or religious experience and growth.

    And 103:2.1 does teach that people have both forms of being born in the spirit.  So, I wonder if being reborn applies only to those souls and minds who gave birth to soul but have since not responded to or acknowledged or embraced the Spirit within?  The Master said over and over one must be “reborn”.  An interesting issue.  We know the Ministering Spirits are each and all in full time service and ministry to our mind….some of us just do not respond….or do not appear to respond.  Some of us then must make such a choice of consecration later in life while some minds are naturally and gently led into Spiritization without great resistance and strife?

    In any case….resistance to the Spirit does deliver suffering while Spiritization of mind reduces suffering and changes its very nature IMO.  Sometimes, evidently, we ‘suffer’ from good fortune we perceive as bad luck or misfortune.  We are considered only semi-civilized on our world and below we are taught how suffering progresses due specifically to the growth of civilization – in addition to personal spiritization! Sorry for the length but an interesting perspective:

    118:10.9 (1305.4) Some of the amazingly fortuitous conditions occasionally prevailing on the evolutionary worlds may be due to the gradually emerging presence of the Supreme, the foretasting of his future universe activities. Most of what a mortal would call providential is not; his judgment of such matters is very handicapped by lack of farsighted vision into the true meanings of the circumstances of life. Much of what a mortal would call good luck might really be bad luck; the smile of fortune that bestows unearned leisure and undeserved wealth may be the greatest of human afflictions; the apparent cruelty of a perverse fate that heaps tribulation upon some suffering mortal may in reality be the tempering fire that is transmuting the soft iron of immature personality into the tempered steel of real character.

    118:10.10 (1305.5) There is a providence in the evolving universes, and it can be discovered by creatures to just the extent that they have attained capacity to perceive the purpose of the evolving universes. Complete capacity to discern universe purposes equals the evolutionary completion of the creature and may otherwise be expressed as the attainment of the Supreme within the limits of the present state of the incomplete universes.

    118:10.12 (1306.1) In the beginnings on an evolutionary world the natural occurrences of the material order and the personal desires of human beings often appear to be antagonistic. Much that takes place on an evolving world is rather hard for mortal man to understand — natural law is so often apparently cruel, heartless, and indifferent to all that is true, beautiful, and good in human comprehension. But as humanity progresses in planetary development, we observe that this viewpoint is modified by the following factors:

    118:10.13 (1306.2) 1. Man’s augmenting vision — his increased understanding of the world in which he lives; his enlarging capacity for the comprehension of the material facts of time, the meaningful ideas of thought, and the valuable ideals of spiritual insight. As long as men measure only by the yardstick of the things of a physical nature, they can never hope to find unity in time and space.

    118:10.14 (1306.3) 2. Man’s increasing control — the gradual accumulation of the knowledge of the laws of the material world, the purposes of spiritual existence, and the possibilities of the philosophic co-ordination of these two realities. Man, the savage, was helpless before the onslaughts of natural forces, was slavish before the cruel mastery of his own inner fears. Semicivilized man is beginning to unlock the storehouse of the secrets of the natural realms, and his science is slowly but effectively destroying his superstitions while at the same time providing a new and enlarged factual basis for the comprehension of the meanings of philosophy and the values of true spiritual experience. Man, the civilized, will someday achieve relative mastery of the physical forces of his planet; the love of God in his heart will be effectively outpoured as love for his fellow men, while the values of human existence will be nearing the limits of mortal capacity.

    118:10.15 (1306.4) 3. Man’s universe integration — the increase of human insight plus the increase of human experiential achievement brings him into closer harmony with the unifying presences of Supremacy — Paradise Trinity and Supreme Being. And this is what establishes the sovereignty of the Supreme on the worlds long settled in light and life. Such advanced planets are indeed poems of harmony, pictures of the beauty of achieved goodness attained through the pursuit of cosmic truth. And if such things can happen to a planet, then even greater things can happen to a system and the larger units of the grand universe as they too achieve a settledness indicating the exhaustion of the potentials for finite growth.

    And one of my favorite Taoist/Zen stories on good luck and bad and suffering:

    Fortune or Misfortune?

    One day in late summer, an old farmer was working in his field with his old sick horse. The farmer felt compassion for the horse and desired to lift its burden. So he left his horse loose to go the mountains and live out the rest of its life.

    Soon after, neighbors from the nearby village visited, offering their condolences and said, “What a shame.  Now your only horse is gone.  How unfortunate you are!. You must be very sad. How will you live, work the land, and prosper?” The farmer replied: “Who knows? We shall see”.

    Two days later the old horse came back now rejuvenated after meandering in the mountainsides while eating the wild grasses. He came back with twelve new younger and healthy horses which followed the old horse into the corral.
    Word got out in the village of the old farmer’s good fortune and it wasn’t long before people stopped by to congratulate the farmer on his good luck.  “How fortunate you are!” they exclaimed. You must be very happy!”  Again, the farmer softly said, “Who knows? We shall see.”

    At daybreak on the next morning, the farmer’s only son set off to attempt to train the new wild horses, but the farmer’s son was thrown to the ground and broke his leg.  One by one villagers arrived during the day to bemoan the farmer’s latest misfortune.  “Oh, what a tragedy!  Your son won’t be able to help you farm with a broken leg. You’ll have to do all the work yourself, How will you survive? You must be very sad”.  they said.  Calmly going about his usual business the farmer answered, “Who knows? We shall see”

    Several days later a war broke out. The Emperor’s men arrived in the village demanding that young men come with them to be conscripted into the Emperor’s army.  As it happened the farmer’s son was deemed unfit because of his broken leg.  “What very good fortune you have!!” the villagers exclaimed as their own young sons were marched away. “You must be very happy.” “Who knows? We shall see!”, replied the old farmer as he headed off to work his field alone.

    As time went on the broken leg healed but the son was left with a slight limp. Again the neighbors came to pay their condolences. “Oh what bad luck. Too bad for you”!  But the old farmer simply replied; “Who knows? We shall see.”
    As it turned out the other young village boys had died in the war and the old farmer and his son were the only able bodied men capable of working the village lands. The old farmer became wealthy and was very generous to the villagers. They said: “Oh how fortunate we are, you must be very happy”, to which the old farmer replied, “Who knows? We shall see!”

    Me here:  I wonder how much of our suffering is self invented and self inflicted by the mind poisons of anxiety and fear?  I believe it was Twain who said – “Nine out of ten of the worst things that ever happened to me….never did happen!”

    ;-)

    #28042
    Avatar
    Gene
    Participant

    How about let’s do a thought experiment and separate physical pain from suffering? What then remains for suffering?

    is it a switch that can be turned off?

    would you want to?

     

     

    #28047
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant

    And 103:2.1 does teach that people have both forms of being born in the spirit.  So, I wonder if being reborn applies only to those souls and minds who gave birth to soul but have since not responded to or acknowledged or embraced the Spirit within?

    Speaking only of myself here, not as a TUB scholar, I’ve never understood rebirth.  I don’t think I’ve ever experienced it. If I had to attach that label to something in my own spiritual life, it would have to be the moment when I realized sonship.  But sonship is another one of those wiggly words where the intellectual idea means one thing and the personal experience brings you to an entirely different place. So, maybe what I’m trying to say is that my rebirth, if I had one, might have been a personal religious experience between myself and the spirit person who lives inside of me, that very moment I realized the whole thing is very REAL and not a manipulation of my imagination. That moment was profound for me.  But to be honest, I really don’t know.  My gut tells me that it doesn’t have to be all that dramatic, any level of recognition and commitment to the relationship would suffice.

    In any case….resistance to the Spirit does deliver suffering while Spiritization of mind reduces suffering and changes its very nature IMO.

    Yes, I agree with that.  The spiritized mind views reality differently.  It’s a little like putting on 3-D glasses.  The world is more interesting, it lights up differently when using spiritual luminosity as your light source.  What really changes are the MEANINGS (not shouting).  Instead of perceiving two dimensional meanings between myself and the outside world, spirit vision gives me three dimensional meanings – meanings that involve me, the outside world, and God . . . it’s a more well-rounded view that helps pick up on all the truth, beauty and goodness amidst the suffering.  The MEANING of suffering becomes more important that the suffering itself.

    Me here:  I wonder how much of our suffering is self invented and self inflicted by the mind poisons of anxiety and fear?

    If we’re talking about civilization here, based on the quotes you chose, I would say the world’s biggest problem is SCAPEGOATING the inability to accept reality for what it is, the failure to recognize the hand of Deity and the role of divinity, along with the unwillingness to ” . . . reckon with the elliptic symmetry of reality and with the essential curvature of all relation concepts.”(103:6.14) 

     

    #28048
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant

    How about let’s do a thought experiment and separate physical pain from suffering? What then remains for suffering? is it a switch that can be turned off?

    Doesn’t it depend on how you personally define suffering?  One person’s suffering might be another person’s joy.

    I think a more fun exercise would be to find the switch that turns any kind of suffering into something new.  I’ve discovered that prayer during suffering is that switch for me.  At the very least, knowing that I am allowed to share my suffering with the lovely spirit person inside of me really helps, and knowing that he is interested and cares pretty much takes the sting out of it altogether.   Then, all that is left is looking for material ways to solve the problem if possible, and that is also found in prayer, or reflective thinking.

    #28049
    Avatar
    Gene
    Participant

    How about let’s do a thought experiment and separate physical pain from suffering? What then remains for suffering? is it a switch that can be turned off?

    Doesn’t it depend on how you personally define suffering? One person’s suffering might be another person’s joy. I think a more fun exercise would be to find the switch that turns any kind of suffering into something new. I’ve discovered that prayer during suffering is that switch for me. At the very least, knowing that I am allowed to share my suffering with the lovely spirit person inside of me really helps, and knowing that he is interested and cares pretty much takes the sting out of it altogether. Then, all that is left is looking for material ways to solve the problem if possible, and that is also found in prayer, or reflective thinking.

    yes, a positive redirect. should be standard practice

    #28051
    Bradly
    Bradly
    Participant

    How about let’s do a thought experiment and separate physical pain from suffering? What then remains for suffering? is it a switch that can be turned off? would you want to?

    Good idea….the suffering of physical pain, hunger, thirst, disease, violence, poverty, war, refugee homelessness by disaster or war, etc. – the physiological and very real suffering all must endure…especially children and the helpless who are obvious victims of situation and circumstance beyond their personal control and have little or nothing to do with personal choice, motive, priority, etc.  Some of thee who suffer only occasionally with the sprain, broken bone, ulcer, and curable malady….others more chronically…and some very severely.  These suffering ones are those for whom we are to have compassion and act in service to alleviate, cure, and offer functional support mechanisms and personal care….personally and institutionally.

    As you ask…”What then remains for suffering?”  Thank you Gene for the distinction…the philosophical discussion of suffering sounds very callous without such a clear debarkation line of consideration.  Indeed, before moving back again to those who ‘suffer’ from those self selected and embraced forms of suffering, I think we should examine those who do indeed suffer from those indignities and infirmaries and circumstances beyond their choosing or control.

    I am beginning to understand there are Agondonters and then there are AGNDONTERS!!!  Consider my own example.  Born a white male in 50’s America in a loving dual parent family with grandparents, aunts and uncles, cousins, financial security (poor but I didn’t know it) in a working/middle class Midwestern town, straight, Christian, educated, opportunity, and loved deeply by many.  What the heck do I know about suffering?   Really??!!!!!!!  How could I ever measure up to the Agondonter status and character of those who have overcome all the adversities of those who grew up without one or two or five or ALL of those advantages???!!!!!  Now….I have suffered.  But not relatively or comparatively!

    There is nothing that inspires me and confounds me more than those individuals who suffer immensely and personally and yet rise above their own self and self interest and self importance (and the self is important) to smile, and laugh, and then serve others selflessly and nobly and at cost/loss to self!  What the heck???  It’s on the news every night.  And then there are those who obviously suffer from lack, loss, disaster, impossible situations, and then RUSH to help others who suffer even more than they do!!!  Humbling and inspiring.

    This growing understanding helps me know what is meant by false sympathy in the UB.  Feeling sorry for those who suffer from their own choices and feel sorry for themselves.  Not even worthy of pity really.  And sympathy and assistance becomes only a form of enabling of a potentially fatal flaw in perspective.

     

    Sister Bonita….thanks so much for your perspective.  While I have had to rededicate and refocus my commitment to the Spirit Within from time to time in my youth and immaturity, I must say my experience is similar.  I do not remember a time I did not ‘believe’ in God and his love for me.  My religious life has taken many turns in life, but disbelief or dishonor or separation from God has never been more than a brief detour of immaturity and misjudgment….decades ago.  Which is not to say my growth has been smooth and hassle free.  I have managed much self inflicted suffering in my stupidity and stubbornness.  And I have much yet to grow as a tadpole to become and realize my potential.

    ;-)

    #28052
    André
    André
    Participant

    Dearest friends,

    Suffering : def.

    experiential possibilities =  pain and suffering

    Rightdoing and the wrongdoing are at the base of our humble reality.

    It is from this reality we are ascending individuals. For sure, it is a climbing ladder for manhood’s beings with will, with the power of moral decision and spiritual choice.

    Evil (anxiety and pain) is only the misadaptation of immaturity and ignorance.  130:1.5

    Sufferings and pains results from immaturity and ignorance. Not self invented and self inflicted by the mind poisons of anxiety and fear

    Anxiety is defined in TUB as a natural stateof the savage mind not a poison of the mind, but an efficient tool to unfailingly institutes evolutionary changes and biologic adaptations.86:2.1

    All of the above represents a personal perspective and haven’t eyes for” disrespectful consideration towards any truth seeker.

    André

    #28054
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant

    Sufferings and pains results from immaturity and ignorance. Not a self invented and self inflicted by the mind poisons of anxiety and fear

    To be fair, I think by saying “self-inflicted” and “self-invented”, Bradly is referring to immature and/or ignorant choosing.  And isn’t fear and anxiety a symptom of immaturity and ignorance?  I don’t mean this as a challenge to your point André, but as an additional way to look at it. These definitions are rather circular, which is why I think we are given so many mercy credits and so much time to evolve.  Of course we begin our journey immature and ignorant, so we all experience fear and anxiety in the process of negotiating the tender balance between our selves and reality.  The more we trust, the more we advance.  The more we advance the less immature and ignorant we are.  The less immature and ignorant we are, the less fear and anxiety we have. The less fear and anxiety we have, the more we trust.  It’s a circle, which is why they call it psychic circles, I think.   Self-inflicted would mean putting the brakes on the circle and/or trying to go the other way.  Right?

     

    #28059
    Bradly
    Bradly
    Participant

    Dearest friends,

    Suffering : def.

    experiential possibilities = pain and suffering

    Rightdoing and the wrongdoing are at the base of our humble reality.

    It is from this reality we are ascending individuals. For sure, it is a climbing ladder for manhood’s beings with will, with the power of moral decision and spiritual choice.

    Evil (anxiety and pain) is only the misadaptation of immaturity and ignorance. 130:1.5

    Sufferings and pains results from immaturity and ignorance. Not a self invented and self inflicted by the mind poisons of anxiety and fear

    Anxiety is defined in TUB as a natural stateof the savage mind not a poison of the mind, but an efficient tool to unfailingly institutes evolutionary changes and biologic adaptations.86:2.1

    All of the above represents a personal perspective and haven’t eyes for” disrespectful consideration towards any truth seeker.

    André

    Greetings Andre.  It is true Andre that many things which are inferior and primitive have contributed to planetary evolution.  Some of those are slavery displacing cannibalism, ghost fear leading to a respect for and acknowledgement of the spirits within and without, the fear of death by hunger, enemy, or hungry predator making the mind begin to think which originally only happened by hunger or fear.  Anxiety is also considered an evolutionary, if primitive and savage origins, stepping stone…but it is to lead from the past to the future.  But not to be perpetuated I do not think.  The text you referenced:

    86:2.1 (951.3) Anxiety was a natural state of the savage mind. When men and women fall victims to excessive anxiety, they are simply reverting to the natural estate of their far-distant ancestors; and when anxiety becomes actually painful, it inhibits activity and unfailingly institutes evolutionary changes and biologic adaptations. Pain and suffering are essential to progressive evolution.

    Here’s a mota reference to Twain’s lament:

    (557.5) 48:7.21 19. Anxiety must be abandoned. The disappointments hardest to bear are those which never come.

    The UB is clear in presenting the reality that anxiety is merely a tool for progressive evolution….the reduction of suffering by experiential wisdom and social inter-dependence should result in a reduction of both suffering and anxiety….suffering now while anxious for the future in many ways demonstrate a disconnection from the vine where only trust and faith can deliver true liberty – freedom from worries and fears regarding our material lives and our eternal destiny.  I posted text earlier that described our world today as semi-civilized, progressed from savagery…and with still much civilizing to come….and only by trust and faith will we make such progress…and fear and anxiety will remain but obstacles to that progress.

    113:2.5 [Part III]
    The angels develop an abiding affection for their human associates; and you would, if you could only visualize the seraphim, develop a warm affection for them. Divested of material bodies, given spirit forms, you would be very near the angels in many attributes of personality. They share most of your emotions and experience some additional ones. The only emotion actuating you which is somewhat difficult for them to comprehend is the legacy of animal fear that bulks so large in the mental life of the average inhabitant of Urantia. The angels really find it hard to understand why you will so persistently allow your higher intellectual powers, even your religious faith, to be so dominated by fear, so thoroughly demoralized by the thoughtless panic of dread and anxiety.

    Thanks Bonita for the immaturity and ignorance references….my attempted point.  Self infliction and self invented (see Twain’s quote and the mota quote) is simply the choices, motives, priorities, and intentions applied at every intersection of decision, situation, circumstance, and relationship.  Certainly not all suffering is caused by self infliction/invented…but just as certainly anxiety does cause a great deal of suffering.

    148:2.2 [Part IV]
    Many of the cures effected by Jesus in connection with his ministry in behalf of Elman’s patients did, indeed, appear to resemble the working of miracles, but we were instructed that they were only just such transformations of mind and spirit as may occur in the experience of expectant and faith-dominated persons who are under the immediate and inspirational influence of a strong, positive, and beneficent personality whose ministry banishes fear and destroys anxiety.

    #28060
    Bradly
    Bradly
    Participant

    Fear and anxiety certainly are mind poisons…and we should consider the effect of poison on any biological or mental/spiritual system in infects.

    110:1.5 (1204.3) The Adjuster remains with you in all disaster and through every sickness which does not wholly destroy the mentality. But how unkind knowingly to defile or otherwise deliberately to pollute the physical body, which must serve as the earthly tabernacle of this marvelous gift from God. All physical poisons greatly retard the efforts of the Adjuster to exalt the material mind, while the mental poisons of fear, anger, envy, jealousy, suspicion, and intolerance likewise tremendously interfere with the spiritual progress of the evolving soul.

    111:7.5 (1223.7) “Much of my difficulty was due to the unending conflict between the two natures of my subject: the urge of ambition opposed by animal indolence; the ideals of a superior people crossed by the instincts of an inferior race; the high purposes of a great mind antagonized by the urge of a primitive inheritance; …………. the buoyancy of health neutralized by the debility of disease; the fountain of faith polluted by the poisons of fear; the spring of joy embittered by the waters of sorrow; the gladness of anticipation disillusioned by the bitterness of realization; the joys of living ever threatened by the sorrows of death. Such a life on such a planet! And yet, because of the ever-present help and urge of the Thought Adjuster, this soul did achieve a fair degree of happiness and success and has even now ascended to the judgment halls of mansonia.”

    Perhaps it is time to consider sorrow and grief as it relates to suffering.  Jesus felt the sting of both.  First as a child losing his father, a true hero figure who adored his son and children and wife.  And also in his many travels did he witness true suffering.  Many of his miracles (real ones) were his expression of compassion for the suffering of others, now his beloved children.

    Upon reflection….I think my own greatest source of suffering is watching and knowing of the suffering of those I love and, more and more, those I don’t know at all.  But as a parent and grandparent and friend and neighbor and citizen….I must also suffer to allow free will and honor the repercussions which attend it.  We are told to be careful of false sympathy….which is that sympathy extended to those who lay down before the repercussions of their own choices without struggle, hope, faith, resilience, persistence, and without learning/adapting so to improve our choices.  My biggest mistakes in parenting have been made managing the protection of loved ones from the consequences of immature and unwise choices OR watching them suffer from such consequences.  Quite a pickle.  What a learning curve!  Still struggle with this one.

    Interestingly, I have lost my sense of grief for the dead….even those taken too early.  I grieve for the hole left in the hearts and lives of those left behind…but I know the mortal dead now sleep in peace awaiting the heavenly abode and the eternal adventures to come.

    It is only my trust in God and my faith in his power, purpose, plan, and love for me that helps me in such difficult times to know that the mistakes made by me or others will be lovingly and mercifully addressed in time to come.  The Papers are epochal revelation to lift the world (and the student) out of the strife of uncertainty and fear….minds poisoned by the legacy of savagery and self importance.  And deliver us a philosophy of living which delivers relief from the vicissitudes and delivers joy and peace to our minds.  We are not to be anxious for our daily bread or tomorrow’s challenges…or fear calamity in our material lives.  Fear not taught the Master, over and over and over again.

    99:4.4 (1089.12) No matter what upheavals may attend the social and economic growth of civilization, religion is genuine and worth while if it fosters in the individual an experience in which the sovereignty of truth, beauty, and goodness prevails, for such is the true spiritual concept of supreme reality. And through love and worship this becomes meaningful as fellowship with man and sonship with God.

    99:4.5 (1090.1) After all, it is what one believes rather than what one knows that determines conduct and dominates personal performances. Purely factual knowledge exerts very little influence upon the average man unless it becomes emotionally activated. But the activation of religion is superemotional, unifying the entire human experience on transcendent levels through contact with, and release of, spiritual energies in the mortal life.

    99:4.6 (1090.2) During the psychologically unsettled times of the twentieth century, amid the economic upheavals, the moral crosscurrents, and the sociologic rip tides of the cyclonic transitions of a scientific era, thousands upon thousands of men and women have become humanly dislocated; they are anxious, restless, fearful, uncertain, and unsettled; as never before in the world’s history they need the consolation and stabilization of sound religion. In the face of unprecedented scientific achievement and mechanical development there is spiritual stagnation and philosophic chaos.

    #28061
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant

    Anxiety is an interesting emotion.  I think it’s natural and necessary.  It’s undue or excessive anxiety which is the problem.  How can there be a world without anxiety if the definition of anxiety is fear of the unknown.  Won’t there always be unknowns? Won’t there always be some level of doubt or confusion concerning the unknown while you’re in the process of making it a known?  Even when you have the most trusting personality on the planet, there are bound to be circumstances that occur which are totally alien and frightening.  The first human response is anxiety until the higher mind gains control over the situation and wisdom kicks in.

    Today’s culture seems to dwell on the need to get rid of all anxiety, believing that all people should live in a world where worry and fear are constantly mitigated (preferably by the government and other large institutions).  Doesn’t this weaken civilization?  People have to deal with their own anxieties in order to evolve.  It’s part of life, I think. Then there’s the other angle . . . taking away all anxieties would probably create a brand new anxiety like, Hey!  What happened?  Something’s different . . . oh no . . . that can’t be good . . . . must be a trick!

    #28062
    Bradly
    Bradly
    Participant

    I would agree it’s natural or normal enough.  As to “necessary”, I would say its necessity is determined by its value to seek out meaningful and effective reduction….which can only truly be delivered by the mind’s spiritization and growing trust and faith.  I find the UB’s teaching on the importance of the time-unit perspective to help such delivery from anxiety.

    I would say big pharma is certainly profiting from the desire to relieve anxiety.  As is commercial escapism and distraction industries.  It does seem everyone (or most everyone) who feels anxiety is looking for its relief…the very purpose for such a natural and normal feeling.  At first it saves the savage’s life and drives us into cooperation and tolerance with others.  Then it leads to the scientific discover of the causes of the effects once thought to be luck or misfortune as delivered by the spirit world.  Anxiety leaves a long back trail of social evolution to be sure.

    As you say Bonita…the higher mind leads one out of anxiety….especially the adjutant’s of wisdom and worship, as does the growth of soul and the progress through the circles.  So I think the only true value to be found in anxiety today is the search for that and whom brings comfort and understanding to mind….if it does not lead to the spirit, what value then?  During the ordination, Jesus said – “…. Seek first the kingdom of God, and when you have found entrance thereto, all things needful shall be added to you. Be not, therefore, unduly anxious for the morrow. Sufficient for the day is the trouble thereof.”

    One trouble with anxiety is its ability to paralyze us and make us less effective for the troubles of the day….which I have also found to be “sufficient”….hahahaha!  Jesus had such a wry sense of humor.

    #28063
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant

    Perhaps it is time to consider sorrow . . .

    They say the sorrow and disappointment come from trying to act out untruth (2:7.6). But there is another kind of sorrow, divine sorrow (4:3.5).  I think something like that went through Jesus’ mind when he walked into the upper chamber for the passover meal.  It’s the sorrow a father feels when he’s done everything he can to teach his rapscallion offspring and they won’t hear a dang thing he says.  It’s gotta be painful.

    Then there’s this:

    25:1.6 Sorrow cannot exist in the face of the consciousness of divine duty faithfully performed.

    Which is cool.  Consciousness of faithfully performing one’s duty is a tonic for sorrow.  I try hard to live that way, although I’m never 100% sure I’m doing God’s will, I have faith that he’ll let me know by allowing some of that non-divine type of sorrow to creep in.  It’s a clue for the psyche. I think non-divine sorrow includes regret and disappointment (the stuff that comes from trying to act out untruth).

    #28064
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant

    One trouble with anxiety is its ability to paralyze us and make us less effective for the troubles of the day . . .

    Well, paralysis is definitely not good.  But that quote you offered earlier says that when anxiety becomes painful, it inhibits activity and UNFAILINGLY causes evolutionary changes.  Is that paralysis?  Or, is it simply forcing a person to STOP AND THINK, to engage those higher mind adjutants in order to solve the problem?  I think paralysis comes in this type of situation only when you STOP AND DON’T THINK, (or in the case of our so-called modern society, look for a scapegoat to sacrifice.)

    86:2.1 (951.3) Anxiety was a natural state of the savage mind. When men and women fall victims to excessive anxiety, they are simply reverting to the natural estate of their far-distant ancestors; and when anxiety becomes actually painful, it inhibits activity and unfailingly institutes evolutionary changes and biologic adaptations. Pain and suffering are essential to progressive evolution.

     

    #28069
    Avatar
    Mark Kurtz
    Participant

    Bonita, et al,

    What could be the ” evolutionary changes” and the “biologic adaptions” mentioned in 86:2.1 shown above?

Viewing 15 posts - 61 through 75 (of 93 total)

Login to reply to this topic.

Not registered? Sign up here.