Urantia Book eugenics

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  • #27068

    Anonymous

    Much has been mentioned about heredity or heritage when in regards to offspring and there is much to be said about this in the UB, however from my studies on this subject, there is little to be said or proven that our parents play a major part in the intellectual or mental makeup of their offspring.  Two parents of average or lesser stock may produce an offspring who could be considered a genius as well as from two parents of higher stock or considered genius’ could produce offspring of lesser stock.  Therefore when we were to look at the offspring of Albert Einstein and his first wife Marić Einstein, which both where considered as very high functioning parents, their three children indicated that heritage does not play a major part in procreation or lineage.  Their first child Lieserl Einstein (born January 1902), had been indicated as mentally challenged and her existence was not well documented.  Their second child, first son, Hans Albert Einstein (born May 14, 1904) seemed to turn out very normal if not above average, however their second son, Eduard Einstein (born July 28 1910), had been diagnosed with with schizophrenia, and was taken care of by his mother, later in life and after her death, committed permanently to an asylums having been committed several time previously.

    So, it would seem that selective breeding might produce different offspring than might be expected.

    #27069

    Gene
    Participant

    Taking a tangent here – I read so much about all of the beings that inhabit our local universe that are committed to helping us in so many different capacities and we cannot even see or hear or otherwise contact one of them. Isolation is a beach. Isolation is hurting us.

    Oh bullcrap! (not sure I’m allowed to use that word). Ponder on these quotes:

    50.7.1 7. THE REWARDS OF ISOLATION On first thought it might appear that Urantia and its associated isolated worlds are most unfortunate in being deprived of the beneficent presence and influence of such superhuman personalities as a Planetary Prince and a Material Son and Daughter. But isolation of these spheres affords their races a unique opportunity for the exercise of faith and for the development of a peculiar quality of confidence in cosmic reliability which is not dependent on sight or any other material consideration. It may turn out, eventually, that mortal creatures hailing from the worlds quarantined in consequence of rebellion are extremely fortunate. We have discovered that such ascenders are very early intrusted with numerous special assignments to cosmic undertakings where unquestioned faith and sublime confidence are essential to achievement. 114.5.4 This rather loosely organized and somewhat personally administered planetary government is more than expectedly effective because of the timesaving assistance of the archangels and their ever-ready circuit, which is so frequently utilized in planetary emergencies and administrative difficulties. Technically, the planet is still spiritually isolated in the Norlatiadek circuits, but in an emergency this handicap can now be circumvented through utilization of the archangels’ circuit. Planetary isolation is, of course, of little concern to individual mortals since the pouring out of the Spirit of Truth upon all flesh nineteen hundred years ago. 184.4.6 These are the moments of the Master’s greatest victories in all his long and eventful career as maker, upholder, and savior of a vast and far-flung universe. Having lived to the full a life of revealing God to man, Jesus is now engaged in making a new and unprecedented revelation of man to God. Jesus is now revealing to the worlds the final triumph over all fears of creature personality isolation. The Son of Man has finally achieved the realization of identity as the Son of God. Jesus does not hesitate to assert that he and the Father are one; and on the basis of the fact and truth of that supreme and supernal experience, he admonishes every kingdom believer to become one with him even as he and his Father are one. The living experience in the religion of Jesus thus becomes the sure and certain technique whereby the spiritually isolated and cosmically lonely mortals of earth are enabled to escape personality isolation, with all its consequences of fear and associated feelings of helplessness.In the fraternal realities of the kingdom of heaven the faith sons of God find final deliverance from the isolation of the self, both personal and planetary. The God-knowing believer increasingly experiences the ecstasy and grandeur of spiritual socialization on a universe scale — citizenship on high in association with the eternal realization of the divine destiny of perfection attainment. 34:7.6 Notwithstanding this double disaster to man’s nature and his environment, present-day mortals would experience less of this apparent warfare between the flesh and the spirit if they would enter the spirit kingdom, wherein the faith sons of God enjoy comparative deliverance from the slave-bondage of the flesh in the enlightened and liberating service of wholehearted devotion to doing the will of the Father in heaven. Jesus showed mankind the new way of mortal living whereby human beings may very largely escape the dire consequences of the Caligastic rebellion and most effectively compensate for the deprivations resulting from the Adamic default. “The spirit of the life of Christ Jesus has made us free from the law of animal living and the temptations of evil and sin.” “This is the victory that overcomes the flesh, even your faith.”

    Faith regenerated, all better now.

    #27070
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant

    Faith regenerated, all better now.

    Excellent!

    #27071

    Gene
    Participant

    Much has been mentioned about heredity or heritage when in regards to offspring and there is much to be said about this in the UB, however from my studies on this subject, there is little to be said or proven that our parents play a major part in the intellectual or mental makeup of their offspring. Two parents of average or lesser stock may produce an offspring who could be considered a genius as well as from two parents of higher stock or considered genius’ could produce offspring of lesser stock. Therefore when we were to look at the offspring of Albert Einstein and his first wife Marić Einstein, which both where considered as very high functioning parents, their three children indicated that heritage does not play a major part in procreation or lineage. Their first child Lieserl Einstein (born January 1902), had been indicated as mentally challenged and her existence was not well documented. Their second child, first son, Hans Albert Einstein (born May 14, 1904) seemed to turn out very normal if not above average, however their second son, Eduard Einstein (born July 28 1910), had been diagnosed with with schizophrenia, and was taken care of by his mother, later in life and after her death, committed permanently to an asylums having been committed several time previously. So, it would seem that selective breeding might produce different offspring than might be expected.

    Would you consider Albert to be superior?

    If so, why?

    #27074

    Anonymous

    Would you consider Albert to be superior?

    Isn’t that the point of this topic?  Who are considered as superior and who are inferior?  The UB uses these terms in many ways but they actually do not specify what characteristics might be grouped to define superior or inferior.  The UB does indicate that this group or that is or was superior or inferior in relation to specific associations over a long period of time.  It also indicates that there are different types of superior as associated to civilization.

    So, if we are to accept any kind of “eugenics” as related to a betterment of the human stock, through selective breeding, should we not actually define what is superior verses inferior in order to be able to identify superior breeding stock?

    My presentation using Albert Einstein as an example, was to illustrate that some might consider those who are considered as having a higher intellect as being superior, where those who consider “eugenics” as a viable method of improving or stabilizing a specific group, would consider this as a template for their validation for such a program.  My presentation was to show that this type of thinking does not validate the general idea behind “eugenics”, at least based on heredity.

    So to answer your question, you would need to provide me with a definition of superior, however, as related to intellect, Albert would have been considered as above average.

    #27076

    Gene
    Participant

    How about Stephen Hawkings???

    #27080

    Gene
    Participant

    Possibly another way to think about how to discover superior human beings is to think about what human qualities/traits attract the Seraphim? I would consider Seraphim to be a superior pattern that we can somewhat relate to.

    Who’s listening to Beethovens 9th, or the Goldberg Variations, or any of that bazzar Ravel stuff, just me?

     

    #27083

    Anonymous

    Who’s listening to Beethovens 9th,

    Don’t know about the 9th, I’d rather hear his 10th, based on his Last Night, but also like to listen to Night Castle as well.

    I would consider Seraphim to be a superior pattern that we can somewhat relate to.

    Interesting perspective, where the UB has mentioned that humans and angels are related, as one to another, but how?

    #27088
    Brooklyn_born
    Brooklyn_born
    Participant
    I don’t think there is a best approach. The term, eugenics, carries way too much baggage; the movement has a history of atrocity and racism.  And quite frankly the science of eugenics is meaningless in the mansion world. Personally, I don’t internalize those papers (racialized papers) as they have no relevance to the afterlife and the saving of one’s soul. By the way, could you give an example of misinformation they are spreading?

    I’m encountering significant blow back or negative comments by people who are inclined towards spreading misinformation about the UB. What do you think is the best approach to responding to folks out there who point to “eugenics” as a reason to dismiss the Urantia Book?

    BB

    #27103
    Bradly
    Bradly
    Participant
    I don’t think there is a best approach. The term, eugenics, carries way too much baggage; the movement has a history of atrocity and racism. And quite frankly the science of eugenics is meaningless in the mansion world. Personally, I don’t internalize those papers (racialized papers) as they have no relevance to the afterlife and the saving of one’s soul. By the way, could you give an example of misinformation they are spreading?

    I’m encountering significant blow back or negative comments by people who are inclined towards spreading misinformation about the UB. What do you think is the best approach to responding to folks out there who point to “eugenics” as a reason to dismiss the Urantia Book?

     

    “Racialized”?  You mean the amalgamation of all the colors of the rainbow of the human race into a genetically blended non-white mix of the one race on our world – the human race?   This is not what any racist might envision.  But one who views the past and the future with the perspective of evolutionary struggle to the perfecting process might appreciate the inevitability of the loving and patient process presented within the Papers.

    This error of equating UB/Universal eugenics with racism or racialism offers another distinct contrast in human thinking and Divine planning…and execution of plan.  This issue is either a debunkers ploy or the inexperienced reader’s fallacy polluted by misconception and preconception….personal prejudice in lieu of thoughtful consideration.  Or so I think.

    The “best approach” might be to allow the authors to speak for themselves and to not allow any others to misstate, misquote, misrepresent, twist, torment, or otherwise falsify the text.  Another example of the literalist approach that the authors say what they mean and mean what they say…which is enough, without adding innuendo, hidden meanings, and metaphorical applications of distortion.  Eugenics, as presented in the UB, is not and should not be controversial.  Not one of the original colored or aboriginal ‘races’ exists.  We are all genetic cousins already.  Opposed to amalgamation?  Too late….cousin!  = )

    But probably not the best subject to begin any conversations with due to the obvious “baggage” as BB says.

    #27104

    Gene
    Participant

    When Seraphim get assigned to Urantia, the first thing they do is study our history. I am certain that they do not leave anything undiscovered and I think that all baggage is of interest and good.

    A genetically blended non-white mix? I dont get it, is  white  being left out of the mix?

    The purpose of the Urantia book is to reveal truth and It can and should be taken literally. The authors went to great length to reveal an enormous amount of information to us.

    Not much is said about eugenics except that we should do it and it is associated with morality, ethics, religion, science – all of the good things that will make it work when we decide to let go of our baggage.

    I dont predict any progress toward this in my lifetime but all things are possible.

     

    #27105
    Bradly
    Bradly
    Participant

    A genetically blended non-white mix? I dont get it, is white being left out of the mix?

    Very funny!!  The final result of amalgamation is not ‘white’, no….but the white, so called, is also amalgamating to be sure.  Indeed, white is about as mongrel as they come, no pure or original strain.  From the Andonites to the Andites over 900,000 years, Urantia’s many, many blood lines and DNA have been admixed and admixed, amalgamating as it inherently happens on every evolutionary world.  Our story is unique but it is not singular or too peculiar I doubt.

    Eugenics is merely that loving and wise evolutionary process most often attended and managed by our celestial creators and rulers and aides over a million years or more of time.  Some folk need to grow up and pay attention to the reality of equality, inferiority, and superiority and what those terms ideally might come to mean and eventuate into….evolutionarily speaking!  = )

    #27106

    Anonymous

    Eugenics is merely that loving and wise evolutionary process most often attended and managed by our celestial creators and rulers and aides over a million years or more of time. Some folk need to grow up and pay attention to the reality of equality, inferiority, and superiority and what those terms ideally might come to mean and eventuate into….evolutionarily speaking!

    Bradly, I kinda understand what your saying but, I’m having difficulty in your last sentence above, can you explain what you mean by “Some folk need to grow up and pay attention to the reality of equality, inferiority, and superiority”?  Then you say “those terms ideally might come to mean and eventuate into…” …what?  Can you provide some UB text to explain your statements?  Because what you said previously:

    The “best approach” might be to allow the authors to speak for themselves and to not allow any others to misstate, misquote, misrepresent, twist, torment, or otherwise falsify the text. Another example of the literalist approach that the authors say what they mean and mean what they say…which is enough, without adding innuendo, hidden meanings, and metaphorical applications of distortion.

    Is there not a difference between evolution over millions of years and eugenics, or are you indicating that the “celestial creators and rulers” have been orchestrating things even now in the present?  I don’t want to get into another Monkey Trial here, but it would be a little more clarifying, if you could provide some of what the authors say based on what they, or you actually mean.

    #27107

    Gene
    Participant

    A genetically blended non-white mix? I dont get it, is white being left out of the mix?

    Very funny!! The final result of amalgamation is not ‘white’, no….but the white, so called, is also amalgamating to be sure. Indeed, white is about as mongrel as they come, no pure or original strain. From the Andonites to the Andites over 900,000 years, Urantia’s many, many blood lines and DNA have been admixed and admixed, amalgamating as it inherently happens on every evolutionary world. Our story is unique but it is not singular or too peculiar I doubt. Eugenics is merely that loving and wise evolutionary process most often attended and managed by our celestial creators and rulers and aides over a million years or more of time. Some folk need to grow up and pay attention to the reality of equality, inferiority, and superiority and what those terms ideally might come to mean and eventuate into….evolutionarily speaking! = )

    Well, you did reference the rainbow and without a prism, all light is white.

    As to the reality of equality, inferiority, and superiority – we live in a universe where nothing is equal with one exception. Someone once said that all men are created equal but without God and in a secular environment, the statement is ambiguous, antagonistic and meaningless. God loves us equally.

    I was looking for an indirect UB reference to eugenics but cant find it – I believe it was in the description of the Life Carriers – it was stated that its up to us after their work is finished – may be mistaken. That goes back a long long time eh?

    One more thought – do you think that a completely racially blended planet of beings and the age of light and life are synonymous? Or one could not happen without the other?? How necessary is racial blending to light and life?

    #27109
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant

    Gene wrote:One more thought – do you think that a completely racially blended planet of beings and the age of light and life are synonymous? Or one could not happen without the other?? How necessary is racial blending to light and life?

    52:3.10 The post-Adamic epoch is the dispensation of internationalism. With the near completion of the task of race blending, nationalism wanes, and the brotherhood of man really begins to materialize. Representative government begins to take the place of the monarchial or paternal form of rulership. The educational system becomes world-wide, and gradually the languages of the races give way to the tongue of the violet people. Universal peace and co-operation are seldom attained until the races are fairly well blended, and until they speak a common language.

    I don’t think racial blending and light & life are synonymous.  Racial blending is part of the social evolution leading to light & life.  Light & life is more than a physical and social phenomenon though.  It’s spiritual too.  Racial amalgamation is supposed to eliminate racial animosity and open the human mind to the reality of one human family, then finally, awaken the collective mind to the reality of one human family with God as the Father.  Right now this is only an idea.  This idea has to evolve into an ideal and then finally into reality.  We aren’t even at the ideal level of thinking yet.  That’s why I say wisdom must evolve, and carefully.

     

Viewing 15 posts - 46 through 60 (of 73 total)

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