-
Posts
-
I am probably (more than likely) a late bloomer on this information but I will give it a shot!
Panoptians are the caretakers of the world of the Father and the surrounding prison planets.
…loyal Panoptians served on the seventh Jerusem transition world as the caretakers
and builders on the Father’s sphere and its surrounding seven detention worlds.Panopticon interestingly is defined as follows:
“The Panopticon is a type of institutional building […] to allow a single watchman to observe (-opticon) all (pan-) inmates of an institution without the inmates being able to tell whether or not they are being watched […] The name is also a reference to Panoptes from Greek mythology; he was a giant with a hundred eyes and thus was known to be a very effective watchman.”
Source: wikipedia
I find it fascinating that the revelator uses the name of a Greek mythological creature for the mortal race of a distant planet. I also believe that the name is retroactively (in the comic book world they call this “retcon“) applied to these mortals, so I do not believe that that is their genuine or original name. To me it was given to describe the role they play on the prison world.
Okay, just wanted to share that tidbit
BB
so wait… a Panopticon is designed so that prisoners are not aware they are being watched. Do the rebel agents on the prison world know they are in prison or being guarded, even? Could that explain why they are unrepentant?
BB
Brooklyn_bornParticipant so wait… a Panopticon is designed so that prisoners are not aware they are being watched. Do the rebel agents on the prison world know they are in prison or being guarded, even? Could that explain why they are unrepentant?
B.B., in my first reading of the Urantia Book, this world was a prison planet, but times change, so regardless of what it says, if you are on a planet that was in rebellion, you are a prisoner. So, did you know that you are a prisoner? So, why would anyone else think that they were on a prison world unless the majority of its inhabitance were below the poverty level. If you follow the money, you will find the prison wardens.
Brooklyn_bornParticipant so wait… a Panopticon is designed so that prisoners are not aware they are being watched. Do the rebel agents on the prison world know they are in prison or being guarded, even? Could that explain why they are unrepentant?
B.B., in my first reading of the Urantia Book, this world was a prison planet, but times change, so regardless of what it says, if you are on a planet that was in rebellion, you are a prisoner. So, did you know that you are a prisoner? So, why would anyone else think that they were on a prison world unless the majority of its inhabitance were below the poverty level. If you follow the money, you will find the prison wardens.
Dang! Now you have me wondering if our planet Earth is a prison world and Urantia really is another planet we read about in TUB while thinking it’s us!!! lolol
BB
Panoptians are the caretakers of the world of the Father and the surrounding prison planets.
B.B., I’ve been wondering about the context of the following UB quote for some time:
(610.6) 53:9.1 Early in the days of the Lucifer rebellion, salvation was offered all rebels by Michael. To all who would show proof of sincere repentance, he offered, upon his attainment of complete universe sovereignty, forgiveness and reinstatement in some form of universe service. None of the leaders accepted this merciful proffer. But thousands of the angels and the lower orders of celestial beings, including hundreds of the Material Sons and Daughters, accepted the mercy proclaimed by the Panoptians and were given rehabilitation at the time of Jesus’ resurrection nineteen hundred years ago. These beings have since been transferred to the Father’s world of Jerusem, where they must be held, technically, until the Uversa courts hand down a decision in the matter of Gabriel vs. Lucifer. But no one doubts that, when the annihilation verdict is issued, these repentant and salvaged personalities will be exempted from the decree of extinction. These probationary souls now labor with the Panoptians in the work of caring for the Father’s world.
What I find interesting, is the use of the words, “But no one doubts”, as if there might be a doubt? Also, how does someone “show proof of sincere repentance” if they are in a work camp, and isolated? Plus, if you are considered a traitor, the only way to show repentance, is to show that you are willing to do anything, even betray others with false testimony. Then to indicate that this is conditional on Michael’s “attainment of complete universe sovereignty” and then by its condition upon Jesus’ resurrection, as if there was some doubt that resurrection was possible, where Lucifer stated that resurrection was a natural occurrence. But being that this merciful proclamation was “proclaimed by the Panoptians”, would indicate that this came second handed. So, when I read this passage it sounds as if there is some underlying deception that might be afoot, here.
Also, in the other UB quote where you formed your first opinion:
(607.2) 53:7.1 The Lucifer rebellion was system wide. Thirty-seven seceding Planetary Princes swung their world administrations largely to the side of the archrebel. Only on Panoptia did the Planetary Prince fail to carry his people with him. On this world, under the guidance of the Melchizedeks, the people rallied to the support of Michael. Ellanora, a young woman of that mortal realm, grasped the leadership of the human races, and not a single soul on that strife-torn world enlisted under the Lucifer banner. And ever since have these loyal Panoptians served on the seventh Jerusem transition world as the caretakers and builders on the Father’s sphere and its surrounding seven detention worlds. The Panoptians not only act as the literal custodians of these worlds, but they also execute the personal orders of Michael for the embellishment of these spheres for some future and unknown use. They do this work as they tarry en route to Edentia.
Where the paragraph sounds just fine until you get to the last sentence, “They do this work as they tarry en route to Edentia.” where I wonder, are these spheres, in “route to Edentia”, where to “tarry”, would delay getting there, and would these spheres be considered as ships or some transportation of some kind, or just going around in circles, out of circulation, so that no one would be able to question them? So, if they where “en route” (on the way) to Edentia, have they gotten there yet? Or will they ever get there?
This is what puzzles me. One Revelator tells us no being is domiciled on the World of the Father. Yet we have another Revelator telling us the Panoptians dwell on the World of the Father, acting as its caretaker. What is your understanding of that, Midi?
BB
This is what puzzles me. One Revelator tells us no being is domiciled on the World of the Father. Yet we have another Revelator telling us the Panoptians dwell on the World of the Father, acting as its caretaker. What is your understanding of that, Midi?
In line with what puzzled you B.B., is that one of the things that Lucifer indicated is that the Father is not where it is claimed that the Son’s continue to proclaim, in order to justify the ascension scheme, and that this process is unnecessary because he insisted that resurrection was automatic. Which lead me to come up with a theory as to why there would be a war in heaven, really only based on a declaration that the ascenders should instigate self-assertion, or stick up for their rights.
When one looks up “Father’s worlds” in the UB, you get four hits, where three are back to back, quotes and that last in another section but between these sections the word “secret” comes up several times.
(148.3) 13:2.4 The Trinity-origin beings do not fully share the Father’s worlds; they have their sole homes on the Isle of Paradise in close proximity to the Most Holy Sphere. They often appear on Ascendington, the “bosom of the Father-Son-Spirit,” where they fraternize with their brethren who have come up from the lowly worlds of space.
(148.4) 13:2.5 You might assume that Creator Sons, being of Father-Son origin, would regard Vicegerington as their home, but such is not the case in this universe age of the function of God the Sevenfold. And there are many similar problems that will perplex you, for you are sure to encounter many difficulties as you attempt to understand these things which are so near Paradise. Nor can you successfully reason out these questions; you know so little. And if you knew more about the Father’s worlds, you would simply encounter more difficulties until you knew all about them. Status on any of these secret worlds is acquired by service as well as by nature of origin, and the successive universe ages may and do redistribute certain of these personality groupings.
(148.5) 13:2.6 The worlds of the inner circuit are really fraternal or status worlds more than actual residential spheres. Mortals will attain some status on each of the Father’s worlds save one. For example: When you mortals attain Havona, you are granted clearance for Ascendington, where you are most welcome, but you are not permitted to visit the other six sacred worlds. Subsequent to your passage through the Paradise regime and after your admission to the Corps of the Finality, you are granted clearance for Sonarington since you are sons of God as well as ascenders — and you are even more. But there will always remain one seventh of Sonarington, the sector of the incarnation secrets of the divine Sons, which will not be open to your scrutiny. Never will those secrets be revealed to the ascendant sons of God.
(148.6) 13:2.7 Eventually you will have full access to Ascendington and relative access to the other spheres of the Father except Divinington. But even when you are granted permission to land on five additional secret spheres, after you have become a finaliter, you will not be allowed to visit all sectors of such worlds. Nor will you be permitted to land on the shores of Divinington, the “bosom of the Father,” though you shall surely stand repeatedly at the “right hand of the Father.” Never throughout all eternity will there arise any necessity for your presence on the world of the Thought Adjusters.
Where I added one additional quote after the third notation of “Father’s worlds” because it relates to the previous. Why so many secrets and is there a problem in paradise?
But when you look at the fourth notation you find some addition information which seems to apply, but links the forth with the section it is found.
(1162.6) 106:0.6 4. Ultimates. This level encompasses that which is of master universe significance and impinges on the destiny level of the completed master universe. Paradise-Havona (especially the circuit of the Father’s worlds) is in many respects of ultimate significance.
Where in the following section you find a corresponding narration regarding reality.
(1163.4) 106:0.10 These levels of reality are convenient compromise symbolizations of the present universe age and for the mortal perspective. There are a number of other ways of looking at reality from other-than-mortal perspective and from the standpoint of other universe ages. Thus it should be recognized that the concepts herewith presented are entirely relative, relative in the sense of being conditioned and limited by:
(1163.5) 106:0.11 1. The limitations of mortal language.
(1163.6) 106:0.12 2. The limitations of the mortal mind.
(1163.7) 106:0.13 3. The limited development of the seven superuniverses.
(1163.8) 106:0.14 4. Your ignorance of the six prime purposes of superuniverse development which do not pertain to the mortal ascent to Paradise.
(1163.9) 106:0.15 5. Your inability to grasp even a partial eternity viewpoint.
(1163.10) 106:0.16 6. The impossibility of depicting cosmic evolution and destiny in relation to all universe ages, not just in regard to the present age of the evolutionary unfolding of the seven superuniverses.
(1163.11) 106:0.17 7. The inability of any creature to grasp what is really meant by pre-existentials or by postexperientials — that which lies before beginnings and after destinies.
(1163.12) 106:0.18 Reality growth is conditioned by the circumstances of the successive universe ages. The central universe underwent no evolutionary change in the Havona age, but in the present epochs of the superuniverse age it is undergoing certain progressive changes induced by co-ordination with the evolutionary superuniverses. The seven superuniverses, now evolving, will sometime attain the settled status of light and life, will attain the growth limit for the present universe age. But beyond doubt, the next age, the age of the first outer space level, will release the superuniverses from the destiny limitations of the present age. Repletion is continually being superimposed upon completion.
There would seem to be secrets which are not shared but with specific Son’s and that secrets would shed some doubt on whether what Lucifer was saying might have some truth to it, but then secrets are meant to keep things in the dark, therefore there might be something to the validity to a rebellion, given additional truth.
you are sure to encounter many difficu
Wow! You delved into that one, Midi. The argument you present is strong. Definitely there can be drawn parallels between the “Father’s world” of Paradise and “Father’s world” in the System capital, Satania. I wonder if rebellion is some kind of “secret” phenomenon of creation that enhances the experience of the Supreme Being. There is definitely more to this than what has been revealed in TUB’s literal print.
BB
Hey BB I thought you might be interested in Chris’ interpretation of Panoptia.
Panoptia = the all (pan-) – seeing (op-) place (-tia) (Literally, the Panoptians are “those who see the big picture”. The name of their leader during those times, Ellanora, literally means “the light” , shining in the darkness of the rebellion.)
Just a reminder Chris is going through etymologies of words to get these. He isn’t pulling these interpretations out of a hat lol.
There is definitely more to this than what has been revealed in TUB’s literal print.
B.B., as I have mentioned elsewhere and on the old forums, the use of the name Lucifer, comes with much baggage, all ready attached to it, but in the case of the Urantia Book, I attempt to look at those associations, and limit them to this one book. Where as it has been written, other than by expected narration, I have found nothing of proof, in the UB that could convict Lucifer and his company, of anything other than what has been narrated to make specific points to make him, and them to look like they are guilty of something vial, but if one takes their own circumstances and environment into account to see that there are so many similarities, which we can associate to and also, tend to justify why a rebellion might be necessary. Therefore, when looking at the rebellion as portrayed in the UB, I attempt to see both sides, if possible, given the material available, and if Lucifer’s name were changed to something less known from Earths history, could or would what has been written, regarding the rebellion, change the priori attitude already assumed. Besides there were two other rebellions which Lucifer had experience of and this one, would seem to have been one that pulled in, quite a few personalities, and would still be an issue which seems to require attention. Some things don’t make logical sense in the UB, but this does not mean that the UB does not make sense, or has no validity. Even with the rebellion having been a predominant factor going on, on Urantia, why would a Material Son, pair be sent here without specific instruction or purpose, because at that time rebellion had not been resolved to the point of Michaels seventh bestowal mission. Even under good or normal conditions, would there have been challenges, but then on an experimental world, who was thinking what, when this was put into effect. Sounds like the powers that were in charge either had a specific agenda or there was a distinct problem with the administration. So I refuse to condemn anyone or swear allegiance to anyone or group, until there is no measure of doubt, still remaining in my mind.
Hey BB I thought you might be interested in Chris’ interpretation of Panoptia.
Panoptia = the all (pan-) – seeing (op-) place (-tia) (Literally, the Panoptians are “those who see the big picture”. The name of their leader during those times, Ellanora, literally means “the light” , shining in the darkness of the rebellion.)
Just a reminder Chris is going through etymologies of words to get these. He isn’t pulling these interpretations out of a hat lol.
Yes, TUB, I recall his etymology trace. His is correct and confirms the Greek mythological creature, “Panoptes,” as the source of the Revelation word. I am kind of baffled, however, that Chris did not go far in the history of the word and link it to the Greek mythological creature.
Check it out:
“In Greek mythology, Panoptes (Ancient Greek: Πανόπτης; English translation: “the all-seeing“…”
source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panoptes
BB
There is definitely more to this than what has been revealed in TUB’s literal print.
B.B., as I have mentioned elsewhere and on the old forums, the use of the name Lucifer, comes with much baggage, all ready attached to it, but in the case of the Urantia Book, I attempt to look at those associations, and limit them to this one book. Where as it has been written, other than by expected narration, I have found nothing of proof, in the UB that could convict Lucifer and his company, of anything other than what has been narrated to make specific points to make him, and them to look like they are guilty of something vial, but if one takes their own circumstances and environment into account to see that there are so many similarities, which we can associate to and also, tend to justify why a rebellion might be necessary. Therefore, when looking at the rebellion as portrayed in the UB, I attempt to see both sides, if possible, given the material available, and if Lucifer’s name were changed to something less known from Earths history, could or would what has been written, regarding the rebellion, change the priori attitude already assumed. Besides there were two other rebellions which Lucifer had experience of and this one, would seem to have been one that pulled in, quite a few personalities, and would still be an issue which seems to require attention. Some things don’t make logical sense in the UB, but this does not mean that the UB does not make sense, or has no validity. Even with the rebellion having been a predominant factor going on, on Urantia, why would a Material Son, pair be sent here without specific instruction or purpose, because at that time rebellion had not been resolved to the point of Michaels seventh bestowal mission. Even under good or normal conditions, would there have been challenges, but then on an experimental world, who was thinking what, when this was put into effect. Sounds like the powers that were in charge either had a specific agenda or there was a distinct problem with the administration. So I refuse to condemn anyone or swear allegiance to anyone or group, until there is no measure of doubt, still remaining in my mind.
Very thought provoking is your response. I have wondered about the glaring (at least to me) parallels between events that occurred in Paradise and down here in Satania. The following narrative, in my view, could be interpreted along the lines of Lucifer’s rebellion and imprisonment…
1 The Eternal Son is that infinite personality from whose unqualified personality fetters the Universal Father escaped by the technique of trinitization,
In the above, rebellion would be “trinitization” and “fetters” would be the prison. Perhaps Lucifer ‘s understanding of “trinitization” influenced his manifesto. Please bear with me as I am toying around with this idea. Nothing I say in this missive is written in stone.
I am thinking that Lucifer’s unyielding stance to repentance is because he believes that he too can effect a form of “trinitization,” to escape the “fetters” of the Universe’s first son, Michael; the fetters in this case would be sub-satellite one of the Father’s world. It is this technique of trinitization that perhaps he believes is proof to automatic resurrection inherent in all souls. Also if he sees himself as a “Father” figure rivaling Universal Father, then it could explain why one of the tenets to his doctrine is that UF is a fabrication of the Paradise sons to enslave creation.
BB
TUB wrote:
Hey BB I thought you might be interested in Chris’ interpretation of Panoptia.
Panoptia = the all (pan-) – seeing (op-) place (-tia) (Literally, the Panoptians are “those who see the big picture”. The name of their leader during those times, Ellanora, literally means “the light” , shining in the darkness of the rebellion.)Just a reminder Chris is going through etymologies of words to get these. He isn’t pulling these interpretations out of a hat lol.Yes, TUB, I recall his etymology trace. His is correct and confirms the Greek mythological creature, “Panoptes,” as the source of the Revelation word. I am kind of baffled, however, that Chris did not go far in the history of the word and link it to the Greek mythological creature.
Check it out:
“In Greek mythology, Panoptes (Ancient Greek: Πανόπτης; English translation: “the all-seeing“…”
source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PanoptesWell that is pretty close to what he is saying. You can see how the (pan)/all and the (op-)/see or seeing is in both the words. It wouldn’t surprise me if he is aware of that Greek reference. He doesn’t always say everything he knows about something, I am sure if someone asked him about this reference he would give his 2 cents about it.
In the above, rebellion would be “trinitization” and “fetters” would be the prison. Perhaps Lucifer ‘s understanding of “trinitization” influenced his manifesto.
In this case where you site the following quote:
(79.1) 6:7.1 The Eternal Son is that infinite personality from whose unqualified personality fetters the Universal Father escaped by the technique of trinitization, and by virtue of which he has ever since continued to bestow himself in endless profusion upon his ever-expanding universe of Creators and creatures. The Son is absolute personality; God is father personality — the source of personality, the bestower of personality, the cause of personality. Every personal being derives personality from the Universal Father just as the Original Son eternally derives his personality from the Paradise Father.
If you look at the following quote, you may think differently:
(11.2) 0:7.8 The Universal Father achieves freewill liberation from the bonds of infinity and the fetters of eternity by the technique of trinitization, threefold Deity personalization. The Supreme Being is even now evolving as a subeternal personality unification of the sevenfold manifestation of Deity in the time-space segments of the grand universe.
But, even though it states that the Father achieved “freewill liberation from the bonds of infinity and the fetters of eternity by the technique of trinitization,” in essence what it is saying is that as the UB states that “all live (or exist) within the Father”, He has been able to segregate Himself, through a form of division, and the Infinite Spirit would constitute or reflect the bonds of infinity, and material space, and the Thought Adjuster would represent a reflection of the “fetters of eternity” which would represent time-eternal, and the aspect of the Eternal Son, would represent the offspring of the combination of the Father-Mother, where one would need to keep in mind that the Son, would reflect an androgynous entity, able to create but only within the confines of time and space. I believe that Lucifer understood this technique, more so in that he was from an older order, therefore able to ascertain through spiritual-experience what the Father had done to free Himself, where Lucifer could see the Father and Mother within the human creation, and his message of self-assertion was to experience the Son-ship of the trinitized human creation, body, mind and spirit. Until one asserts themselves, they have no capacity to experience good and evil, for one has no value without the other.
To better illustrate this liberation, or where the “Father’s escaped” from the bondage of eternity, the following quote give a little better read.
(6.2) 0:3.22 In this original transaction the theoretical I AM achieved the realization of personality by becoming the Eternal Father of the Original Son simultaneously with becoming the Eternal Source of the Isle of Paradise. Coexistent with the differentiation of the Son from the Father, and in the presence of Paradise, there appeared the person of the Infinite Spirit and the central universe of Havona. With the appearance of coexistent personal Deity, the Eternal Son and the Infinite Spirit, the Father escaped, as a personality, from otherwise inevitable diffusion throughout the potential of Total Deity. Thenceforth it is only in Trinity association with his two Deity equals that the Father fills all Deity potential, while increasingly experiential Deity is being actualized on the divinity levels of Supremacy, Ultimacy, and Absoluteness.
Where the segregated Father “achieved the realization of personality” indicated that “I AM, that I AM”, because in essence “I AM” is everything, yet able to relate and associate as personality with personality, where if one looks in a mirror, you see a reflection of yourself, but through a distortion of time and space, or the distance between the object and the subjective reflection the faster one realizes reality the slower it can be perceived, or reflected back, where the time it takes to the father to realize the response it has multiplied to a point of infinite individual possibilities. Now that I’ve confused all, think of a motion picture film where there are thousands of individual frames, but when we look at a sequential representation of these frames, we can understand what was intended to be portrayed on this film, but since our Father is everything and can process everything so quickly He reflects the image back in three (trinitized) dimensions, whereby the speed in which this is done creates an essence of time within space. Or something like that?
I am thinking that Lucifer’s unyielding stance to repentance is because he believes that he too can effect a form of “trinitization,” to escape the “fetters” of the Universe’s first son, Michael; the fetters in this case would be sub-satellite one of the Father’s world. It is this technique of trinitization that perhaps he believes is proof to automatic resurrection inherent in all souls. Also if he sees himself as a “Father” figure rivaling Universal Father, then it could explain why one of the tenets to his doctrine is that UF is a fabrication of the Paradise sons to enslave creation.
B.B., I think that Lucifer was well aware of his inability to create, in the same manor in which the Father could use the “technique of trinitization”, but it would seem that the Fathers Sons may have lost the ability to understand this technique because they were the byproduct of the technique, thereby needing to experience the affect of the I AM, for themselves, but once experienced, it would be difficult to describe, because you would actually be in the middle of the process and being pulled from both sides, and if you where not at the center of it all, it could be distorted in the outer realms of the universes, but not being rooted, it is easy to loose prospective on others, going through the same process, even though it may be on the lower end of the spectrum. Pride, can be misinterpreted when one is attempting to assert themselves, and those on the receiving end do not understand that language. We are all in a prison of our own making if we allow others to tell us that this is the way, and that you must take this path, and not look back. When this is done we loose sight of our fellows who are left behind to fend for themselves, and must suffer their own prison and misdirection. When you stand up for what you believe, and what you believe effects others, you will resist repentance until all others have been justly dealt with, and suffer the consequence of your faith as your fate.
Login to reply to this topic.
Not registered? Sign up here.