-
Posts
-
However “way” one is born, the acts we decide to do, are done so by our choices alone.
Otherwise the possession of a sovereign free will can not be true.
No one is ever forced to do anything. Not by another person, not by nature.
It’s my opinion that those who suffer most from hate, prejudice, intolerance, and bigotry and, despite that find love in this life and serve others in love will make the greatest of all Agondonters. America’s greatness, what there is of that, comes specifically and directly from those who were persecuted here or elsewhere over religion, race, culture, color, and sexual orientation, etc. We are rigorous and strengthened primarily by those who suffer the most and overcome that……the upside of hate? The response of resolve and love in triumph builds great character.
Van Amadon wrote:I’m still looking for the quote regarding children.Don’t bother. That’s not what I asked. I asked who said, or where did you get the idea that homosexuals and transgenders have a different destiny? You suggest this is so in the quote below:
If transgenderism and homosexuality were a part of filling a niche in the destiny of universe personalities, why didn’t the revelators mention it . . .
America’s greatness, what there is of that, comes specifically and directly from those who were persecuted here or elsewhere over religion, race, culture, color, and sexual orientation, etc.
That’s a curious statement. Isn’t America’s greatness due to the fact that she tolerates all religions, races, cultures, colors and sexual orientations? I think it’s called freedom? Granted, freedom is relative, there is no such thing as absolute freedom, but if greatness is equivalent to the ability to keep your tongue, it would seem that tolerance is what makes America great, the willingness to tolerate the relative freedom of others who are different. That being said, there is way too much tongue wagging these days and disrespect for the law, but that’s a different topic.
134:6.1 If one man is to be absolutely free, then another must become an absolute slave. And the relative nature of freedom is true socially, economically, and politically. Freedom is the gift of civilization made possible by the enforcement of LAW.
Hi,
what set of RIGHTS and which DOMAIN do homosexuals have?
A very simpliest answer.
Depends on their gender.
Tentative to define …
RIGHTS AND DOMAINS.
RIGHTS: men / woman
84:5.10. … recognition, dignity, independence, equality, and education
74:7.22 Adam endeavored to teach the races sex equality …. Adam definitely taught them that the woman, equally with the man.
DOMAINS: men / woman
84:5.13. Forever each sex will remain supreme in its own domain, domains determined by biologic differentiation and by mental dissimilarity.
84:3.5. Among the more advanced races, women… more tactful; she early learned to trade upon her sex charms. She became more alert and conservative than man, though slightly less profound.
Man was woman’s superior on the battlefield and in the hunt; but at home woman has usually outgeneraled even the most primitive of men.
Woman has always been the burden bearer, carrying the family property andtending the children, thus leaving the man’s hands free for fighting or hunting.
This brought about the liberation of woman so that she could devote more time to homemaking and child culture.
. In hunting and war man had learned the value of organization, and he introduced these techniques into industry and later, when taking over much of woman’s work, greatly improved on her loose methods of labor.
… remembered, it is a tentative explanation…. do not kill the paste/copy messenger.
Bonita wrote: . . . what set of RIGHTS and which DOMAIN do homosexuals have? Do they have their own. . . . Since TUB tells us that these domains can and will overlap. . . .
It’s not hard to figure this out when you look in your mind’s eye at the world and see what the domains of men and women are. Rights, per se, are societal and cultural.
Mating is an instinct, but childbirth is the domain of woman, due to biologic specialization. Home building is a big deal because the home is the basic social unit of society, among other things. Homosexuals engage in home building. They make families and have children.
84:7.28 The family is the fundamental unit of fraternity in which parents and children learn those lessons of patience, altruism, tolerance, and forbearance which are so essential to the realization of brotherhood among all men.
The rights of homosexuals vary in accordance with the societal and cultural norms. Over time these norms change. Childbirth is available to some homosexuals. The gonad issues are planetary. Who knows what science will come up with next?
The domains of homosexuals will vary in accordance to preferences and proclivities, which is also true of heteros.
Who knows what the mental dissimilarities are between maleness and femaleness? It’s not biologic, because the revelators already said “. . . domains determined by biologic differentiation and by mental dissimilarity.”
America’s greatness, what there is of that, comes specifically and directly from those who were persecuted here or elsewhere over religion, race, culture, color, and sexual orientation, etc.
That’s a curious statement. Isn’t America’s greatness due to the fact that she tolerates all religions, races, cultures, colors and sexual orientations? I think it’s called freedom? Granted, freedom is relative, there is no such thing as absolute freedom, but if greatness is equivalent to the ability to keep your tongue, it would seem that tolerance is what makes America great, the willingness to tolerate the relative freedom of others who are different. That being said, there is way too much tongue wagging these days and disrespect for the law, but that’s a different topic.
134:6.1 If one man is to be absolutely free, then another must become an absolute slave. And the relative nature of freedom is true socially, economically, and politically. Freedom is the gift of civilization made possible by the enforcement of LAW.
Me: To the degree that we actually deliver such tolerance….YES! The suffering of persecution has led all Americans to America or brought them here as slaves…even the native Americans were fleeing racist based and genocidal persecutions. Prejudice does not deliver our potential or our greatness….it is an obstacle to both….IMO.
I’ve always found it interesting that a group of white men…slave owners some and before suffrage gave women the vote (if not equality), delivered the world a document of such promise, potential, and idealism. The ideal that all people should have equal standing/protection under the law and equal opportunity for personal growth/expression remains an ideal. But we progress toward such idealism. No one is or can be ‘equal’ per se…..but ideally they can all enjoy equal protection and opportunity to achieve their own potential.
That’s not what I asked. I asked who said, or where did you get the idea that homosexuals and transgenders have a different destiny?I don’t think transgenders and homosexuals have a different destiny than anyone Bonita. Like Bradly said, “The response of resolve and love in triumph builds great character.” So they have as great an opportunity as anyone else. They’re going through the same thing everybody is going through, by the choices that are made.
What I’m trying to emphasize is that the revelators don’t reference abnormal sexual identification as a differential of destiny circumstance, like the circumstances that lead to Son fusion.
This indicates to me that homosexuality and transgenderism is not something that’s special, and that it’s not a distinction people are “born with.”
If it is special in the circumstance of it predetermining how a person is somehow limited in free will chosing how to behave, I’m certain the revelation would have included an explanation of why this is true. That being born in a way that isn’t normal sexually would be something that would affect an inability to choose an action. To choose a sex act.
If transgenderism and homosexuality has things to do with the sex act that is.
To me, some of the most important distinctions of what the book says is what it doesn’t say, because from the standpoint of things needing to be mentioned, some things aren’t important apparently.
Like not mentioning the Mormon religion in regard to the morontia appearances of the Master.
It’s a non-issue for Mormons to work out, the same way with transgenders and homosexuals.
For what it’s worth, to pidgeon hole my beliefs and opinions into the bigotry racism intolerance cesspool is just another form of intolerance with the added benefit of avoiding reality and valid opposition; make me out to be horrible in order to divert attention from what is receiving valid criticism. That’s ok, I get it quite a bit for lots of stuff above and beyond sexual deviants. Like I said, I get along with lots of people and sometimes getting along can be misinterpreted as tolerance of deviant or destructive behavior and getting along can in itself precipitate destructive results if we think with the wrong head!
non sexual example: my daughters heroin use – I can’t recall how many times I was duped into doing things for her that only turned out to enable her destructive behavior and I really knew better but because I loved her without reservation, I did it thinking it may help, better said-not really thinking as a father should – that is where the term “tough love” originates and it is my weakness.
loving someone as brother/sister transcends even the most destructive behaviors and should not be part of tolerance for such behaviors. That’s where the difficult challenge lies if we are to remove the destructive degenerate species. It’s not a subject for this generation.
84:5.13. Forever each sex will remain supreme in its own domain, domains determined by biologic differentiation and by mental dissimilarity.
Regarding mental dissimilarities between males and females, I wonder what part the source of mind plays in imparting the impersonal and individualized circuit. Does it play a part in maleness and femaleness?
9:5.4 Since the Third Person of Deity is the source of mind, it is quite natural that the evolutionary will creatures find it easier to form comprehensible concepts of the Infinite Spirit than they do of either the Eternal Son or the Universal Father. The reality of the Conjoint Creator is disclosed imperfectly in the very existence of human mind. The Conjoint Creator is the ancestor of the cosmic mind, and the mind of man is an individualized circuit, an impersonal portion, of that cosmic mind as it is bestowed in a local universe by a Creative Daughter of the Third Source and Center.For what it’s worth, to pidgeon hole my beliefs and opinions into the bigotry racism intolerance cesspool is just another form of intolerance with the added benefit of avoiding reality and valid opposition; make me out to be horrible in order to divert attention from what is receiving valid criticism.
Hi Gene,
You have every right to your beliefs and opinions. No one has made you out to be horrible. I see no evidence of that. We are, however, having a good conversation about personality and gender issues, as well as other related issues. It’s hard being a father. Your situation with your daugther is sorrowful. It’s hard being a mother too. No two ways about it.
Mara wrote:Regarding to mental dissimilarities between males and females, I wonder what part the source of mind plays in imparting the impersonal and individualized circuit. Does it play a part in maleness and femaleness?
I thought we established that it is personality which determines male or female type. Personality unifies mind. Right?
Incidentally, I just read in the paper that they are going to attempt a uterus transplant. Paper didn’t say what sex the recipient will be.
For what it’s worth, to pidgeon hole my beliefs and opinions into the bigotry racism intolerance cesspool is just another form of intolerance with the added benefit of avoiding reality and valid opposition; make me out to be horrible in order to divert attention from what is receiving valid criticism.
That’s a strong indictment. Nevertheless I stand by my statement that labeling homosexuals as degenerates crosses the line because it paints every homosexual as immoral. There’s nothing immoral about loving another person of the same sex. Having sex with a person you love, if consensual, is not immoral and not a sin regardless of gender. Having sex with a child, on the other hand, a child who cannot make an informed decision on the subject, is horribly immoral. If you want to be outraged about something, be outraged about that and leave loving consensual same-sex couples to their own business. Of course you are permitted to have your opinion on the subject, as am I, but opinions are subject to being right or wrong. None of us know why this happens on earth. Perhaps it’s because we’re a decimal, experimental sphere . . . there’s just not enough info to nail this down yet. Until then, I side with mercy.
If you recall, the midwayers defined friendship in this way:
“Friendship is the first and basic human conviction. It is more than an emotion, it is greater than an impulse, it transcends a sentiment. There is something profound about friendship at its best. It is undoubtedly based on the sentiment of love, and has in association with it many other emotions, including, no doubt, both sympathy and respect. Friendship is the equivalent of love plus loyalty and more or less of the sex-element. It is so influential in human experience that there appear to be no lengths to which it will not go to assert itself and to justify its existence.”
A homosexual relationship is a friendship with more of the sex-element.
I’m sorry….but your opinion is definitely defective and degenerate…..and is only your opinion….definitely. Careful of such poison.
People have a right to have an opinion different from yours, Bradly. Tolerance is the earmark of a great soul. (156:5.18 )
For what it’s worth, to pidgeon hole my beliefs and opinions into the bigotry racism intolerance cesspool is just another form of intolerance with the added benefit of avoiding reality and valid opposition; make me out to be horrible in order to divert attention from what is receiving valid criticism.
That’s a strong indictment. Nevertheless I stand by my statement that labeling homosexuals as degenerates crosses the line because it paints every homosexual as immoral. There’s nothing immoral about loving another person of the same sex. Having sex with a person you love, if consensual, is not immoral and not a sin regardless of gender. Having sex with a child, on the other hand, a child who cannot make an informed decision on the subject, is horribly immoral. If you want to be outraged about something, be outraged about that and leave loving consensual same-sex couples to their own business. Of course you are permitted to have your opinion on the subject, as am I, but opinions are subject to being right or wrong. None of us know why this happens on earth. Perhaps it’s because we’re a decimal, experimental sphere . . . there’s just not enough info to nail this down yet. Until then, I side with mercy. If you recall, the midwayers defined friendship in this way:
“Friendship is the first and basic human conviction. It is more than an emotion, it is greater than an impulse, it transcends a sentiment. There is something profound about friendship at its best. It is undoubtedly based on the sentiment of love, and has in association with it many other emotions, including, no doubt, both sympathy and respect. Friendship is the equivalent of love plus loyalty and more or less of the sex-element. It is so influential in human experience that there appear to be no lengths to which it will not go to assert itself and to justify its existence.”
A homosexual relationship is a friendship with more of the sex-element.
im ok with crossing this line
its a behavior that cannot help progressive evolution. But again, I have stated before that I really do not know what degenerate destructive types that Adam and Eve were responsible for getting rid of. I only know that their feelings and realization of failure and being left alone especially when denied council from the Melchizedeks is something I can identify with and I also feel that we have inherited this same responsibility. I don’t have the wisdom to sort it out and I don’t know anybody that does. That don’t mean we don’t work on it and try to figure it out.
i can identify many behaviors that id like to get rid of but that’s just me with my limited mentality lacking real wisdom – like most people. Yes, mercy is good but it’s not an excuse to do nothing.
Login to reply to this topic.
Not registered? Sign up here.