Living Loyally

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  • #12660
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant

    100:1.4 Loyal persons are growing persons, and growth is an impressive and inspiring reality. Live loyally today — grow — and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole.

    I’ve often wondered what it means to live loyally.  We have been given fantastic examples of loyal living in Amadon, Van and Jesus; but how does that translate to us in our everyday moment-to-moment living?  I’m sure living loyally means living according to God’s will, but most of us don’t have a clue whether or not we’re really doing that.  We’re told in 100:1.4 that a loyal person is a growing person. Yet elsewhere we are told that true growth is unconscious.  Can we ever be certain that we are living loyally?

    100:1.8 The factors of religious growth may be intentional, but the growth itself is unvaryingly unconscious.

     

    #12668
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    emanny3003
    Blocked

    I’ve often wondered what it means to live loyally.  We have been given fantastic examples of loyal living in Amadon, Van and Jesus; but how does that translate to us in our everyday moment-to-moment living?  I’m sure living loyally means living according to God’s will, but most of us don’t have a clue whether or not we’re really doing that.  We’re told in 100:1.4 that a loyal person is a growing person. Yet elsewhere we are told that true growth is unconscious.  Can we ever be certain that we are living loyally?

    LET IT BE! Let God’s will be.

    #12670
    Mara
    Mara
    Participant

    Can we ever be certain that we are living loyally?

    I am always reminded that we faithers, that the only proof we have is personal and within our heart and soul.  To me when inquiring about the certainty of something, such as loyalty, it’s an inner certainty and it is not seen, but rather it is lived.  Doing God’s will by faith.  And if you mess up you will know it.

    This is somewhat incidental, but I like this reference familiar to us, regarding one’s status and standing:

    34:7:8   Having started out on the way of life everlasting, having accepted the assignment and received your orders to advance, do not fear the dangers of human forgetfulness and mortal inconstancy, do not be troubled with doubts of failure or by perplexing confusion, do not falter and question your status and standing, for in every dark hour, at every crossroad in the forward struggle, the Spirit of Truth will always speak, saying, “This is the way.”
    #12675
    Bonita
    Bonita
    Participant

    Thanks Mara.  I love that quote too.  It’s very comforting.

    I guess what I’m struggling with trying to explain is that part of loyalty is faith, and part of faith is uncertainty.   Loyalty is a relationship and relationships are always changing, challenging us to continually seek for perfection.  It’s not something I worry about, just something I think about.  Do I need to know that I’m being loyal?  Sometimes I do, because I’m not entirely sure.  But the uncertainty forces me to seek and it is in the seeking that I find.  Is that making any sense to anyone?

    155:5.11 The religion of the spirit means effort, struggle, conflict, faith, determination, love, loyalty, and progress.

    #12678
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    emanny3003
    Blocked

    155:5.11 The religion of the spirit means effort, struggle, conflict, faith, determination, love, loyalty, and progress.

    This is the practice of the presence of God. This is the struggle to commune with our TA. The struggle lies in that conflict of serving two master. One must lose ones life in order to save it. You must actively be dying in order to be born again of the spirit. One cannot serve our own will and that of God’s. Our will must die in order to live His will. Living loyally is the act of dying. Or as Bradly would say, the tadpole must die for the frog to live.

    #12680
    Mara
    Mara
    Participant
    emanny3003 wrote: . . . is the practice of the presence of God.
    For me communing with God is not a struggle at all.  To me it is not a matter of practicing anything.  It’s a matter of living it.  But the clamor of self for recognition and honor must be whipped.  Sooner or later. everybody will get a handle on it to get to the other side where you stop worrying about wherther you are doing God’s will or not.  At least that’s the way I see it. :-)
    #12681
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    Keryn
    Participant

    We’re told in 100:1.4 that a loyal person is a growing person. Yet elsewhere we are told that true growth is unconscious.

    While I agree with others on this thread that we must trust and have faith, even faith without seeing (knowing).  That said, I think there are some rather simplistic ways we can assess whether or not we, as individuals, are on a growth path in life.  Here is how I think about it:

    growth means change.

    Can we see change in ourselves over time?  Do we notice that we respond to things differently than when we were younger?  Do we notice that we have fewer ego-driven thoughts and more thoughts aimed at doing unto others what we would have done to us?

    Not all change is good, of course.  So the next thing to consider is:

    By their fruits shall ye know them.

    Are the changes we notice in ourselves resulting in positive outcomes?  Are we moving toward goodness, beauty and truth?   Are we experiencing feelings of sincere worship and joy?  Do we have command over our thoughts, words and deeds?  If so, I believe we are living loyally, at least, in some small way.

    #12682
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    emanny3003
    Blocked

    For me communing with God is not a struggle at all.  To me it is not a matter of practicing anything.  It’s a matter of living it.  But the clamor of self for recognition and honor must be whipped.  Sooner or later. everybody will get a handle on it to get to the other side where you stop worrying about wherther you are doing God’s will or not.  At least that’s the way I see it.

    I think we are in agreement, just a matter of semantics. Practicing means doing. Communing with God is an activity. Living is an activity. In order to whip the clamor of self anything is the act of dying. Dying is living I agree with simplicity. Don’t worry, be happy, mon.

    #12685
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    nelsong
    Participant

    Being unconscious of growth simply means that we miss it as it happens. Our hind sight is usually a great indicator that growth happened. i think that whatever you are into, be it your profession, relationships or doing Gods will-if you do it the best you can you will grow. The latter, however-will get you started on eternal life and the formers will tend to keep you here.

    #12686
    Bradly
    Bradly
    Participant

    Great topic Bonita.  First, some definitions for consideration:

    1911 Encyclopædia Britannica[edit]

    The Encyclopædia Britannica Eleventh Edition defines loyalty as “allegiance to the sovereign or established government of one’s country” and also “personal devotion and reverence to the sovereign and royal family”. It traces the word “loyalty” to the 15th century, noting that then it primarily referred to fidelity in service, in love, or to an oath that one has made. The meaning that the Britannica gives as primary, it attributes to a shift during the 16th century, noting that the origin of the word is in the Old French “loialte”, that is in turn rooted in the Latin “lex”, meaning “law”.

    Biblical and Christian views[edit]

    In the Christian Bible, Jesus states “Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar’s and unto God the things that are God’s.” So, it acknowledges a limit to the authority of man. In the Christian view, there is a sphere beyond the earthly, and if loyalty to man conflicts with loyalty to God, the latter takes precedence.[5] Moreover, Christianity rejects the notion of dual loyalty. In the Gospel of Matthew 6:24, Jesus states “No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon”. This relates to the authority of a master over his servants (as per Ephesians 6:5), who according to (Biblical) law owe undivided loyalty to their master (as per Leviticus 25:44–46).[6]

    Josiah Royce’s conception[edit]

    Josiah Royce in his 1908 book The Philosophy of Loyalty presented a different definition of the concept. According to Royce, loyalty is a virtue, indeed a primary virtue, “the heart of all the virtues, the central duty amongst all the duties”. Royce presents loyalty, which he defines at length, as the basic moral principle from which all other principles can be derived.[7] The short definition that he gives of the idea is that loyalty is “the willing and practical and thoroughgoing devotion of a person to a cause”.[1][7][8] Loyalty is thoroughgoing in that it is not merely a casual interest but a wholehearted commitment to a cause.[9]

     

    From these definitions, it appears to me that loyalty is a consecration of our motives, priorities, and choices in support of God’s purpose, power, plan, and that reality in which we live.  It is exemplified, in mortals, by the effort to transfer the seat of our very identity from the material/temporal to the spiritual/eternal.  It is not a measure of skill or wisdom or even progress itself – it is the source of our will and the inspiration of our efforts.  It means, to me, to live as a universe citizen in a friendly universe that is created and managed by God.  It means I must trust God and his purpose, power, and plan for me and for all.  There is no loyalty without trust and those who are disloyal cannot be trusted.  Betrayal of trust is a great error for the ignorant and high treason for those who know they betray a trust with those to whom they have claimed loyalty but acted against those who placed them in a position of trust and those that were so entrusted to their care.

    From wiki: Betrayal is the breaking or violation of a presumptive contract, trust, or confidence that produces moral and psychological conflict within a relationship amongst individuals, between organizations or between individuals and organizations. Often betrayal is the act of supporting a rival group, or it is a complete break from previously decided upon or presumed norms by one party from the others. Someone who betrays others is commonly called a traitor or betrayer.

    (754.3) 67:1.2 In the course of this inspection Satan informed Caligastia of Lucifer’s then proposed “Declaration of Liberty,” and as we now know, the Prince agreed to betray the planet upon the announcement of the rebellion. The loyal universe personalities look with peculiar disdain upon Prince Caligastia because of this premeditated betrayal of trust. The Creator Son voiced this contempt when he said: “You are like your leader, Lucifer, and you have sinfully perpetuated his iniquity. He was a falsifier from the beginning of his self-exaltation because he abode not in the truth.”

    (754.4) 67:1.3 In all the administrative work of a local universe no high trust is deemed more sacred than that reposed in a Planetary Prince who assumes responsibility for the welfare and guidance of the evolving mortals on a newly inhabited world. And of all forms of evil, none are more destructive of personality status than betrayal of trust and disloyalty to one’s confiding friends. In committing this deliberate sin, Caligastia so completely distorted his personality that his mind has never since been able fully to regain its equilibrium.

    (754.5) 67:1.4 There are many ways of looking at sin, but from the universe philosophic viewpoint sin is the attitude of a personality who is knowingly resisting cosmic reality. Error might be regarded as a misconception or distortion of reality. Evil is a partial realization of, or maladjustment to, universe realities. But sin is a purposeful resistance to divine reality — a conscious choosing to oppose spiritual progress — while iniquity consists in an open and persistent defiance of recognized reality and signifies such a degree of personality disintegration as to border on cosmic insanity.

    (755.1) 67:1.5 Error suggests lack of intellectual keenness; evil, deficiency of wisdom; sin, abject spiritual poverty; but iniquity is indicative of vanishing personality control. 

    (51.11) 3:5.12 7. Is loyalty — devotion to highest duty — desirable? Then must man carry on amid the possibilities of betrayal and desertion. The valor of devotion to duty consists in the implied danger of default.

     

    Devotion to “highest” duty.  The rebel leaders betrayed those dependent upon them and their very creator – Michael and the divine Mother Spirit.  Their treachery, or disloyalty and betrayal of trust, is an example of the personally destructive nature of such.  They are believed to be too twisted by their treachery to accept, not receive, love and mercy.  The lack of loyalty to reality is self destructive.  But loyalty to reality results in confidence and trust in that reality by the results of such loyalty to Deity and the purpose, power, and plan of Deity as best we understand it.  Tadpoles may live loyally and grow up without worry or fear if they are motivated by loyalty to our maker and our keepers…..Michael rules his creation and his heavenly hosts keep that creation in order and in safe keeping for all.

    The disloyalty and betrayal of that trust by the Manifesto and all who changed their loyalties to unreality now face the consequences for their choice.  But it is the effect or consequence of iniquity upon the being that knowingly and willingly betrayed such a trust that is the true and self inflicted punishment.

     

    #12692
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    emanny3003
    Blocked

    The disloyalty and betrayal of that trust by the Manifesto and all who changed their loyalties to unreality now face the consequences for their choice.  But it is the effect or consequence of iniquity upon the being that knowingly and willingly betrayed such a trust that is the true and self inflicted punishment.

    53:4.2 Self-assertion was the battle cry of the Lucifer rebellion. One of his chief arguments was that, if self-government was good and right for the Melchizedeks and other groups, it was equally good for all orders of intelligence. He was bold and persistent in the advocacy of the “equality of mind” and “the brotherhood of intelligence.” He maintained that all government should be limited to the local planets and their voluntary confederation into the local systems. All other supervision he disallowed. He promised the Planetary Princes that they should rule the worlds as supreme executives. He denounced the location of legislative activities on the constellation headquarters and the conduct of judicial affairs on the universe capital. He contended that all these functions of government should be concentrated on the system capitals and proceeded to set up his own legislative assembly and organized his own tribunals under the jurisdiction of Satan And he directed that the princes on the apostate worlds do the same.

    He or she among you here that is not guilty of self-assertion, hurl the first stone at Lucifer. He or she among you that is not guilty of wanting self-government and equality of mind, hurl the first stone at Lucifer. He or she that has never advocated for limited government and the notion that that government is best that governs least and coordinates most, let them cast the first stone at Lucifer. Lucifer advocated for reforms in administration that directly contradicted Gabriel’s administration. Is Gabriel upset about this? Damn straight he is. It is a battle of wills between a powerful older brother and an upstart wanting reforms. Show me someone with a stone in hand and I’ll show you a hypocrite.

    #12693
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    nelsong
    Participant

    Hard to follow – for me anyway

    it all sounds like the Devine battle you describe was a human battle.

     

    #12694
    Mara
    Mara
    Participant

    Hard to follow – for me anyway it all sounds like the Devine battle you [emmany3003] describe was a human battle.

    I think know what you mean nelsong.  Until fusion 5:1:11, the power of choice remains – draw near God or forsake the divine will.  Live loyally or not.  Succumb to self-admiration or not.  When our Creator Son leaves Salvington 33:0:1 , executive power is delegated to Gabriel.  Michael’s place is assumed by Gabriel 33:2:5 when he’s away.  Gabriel is a unique and permanent being (as far as I know) in Nebadon.  He is a loyal chief executive of our Creator Son.  He was created that way and he is above reproach.  We will learn more about him as we ascend.  We do not worship him.

    #12698
    Avatar
    emanny3003
    Blocked

    Hard to follow – for me anyway
    it all sounds like the Devine battle you describe was a human battle.

    As above, so below. Except that these heavenly battles are fought with idea and not guns.

    I think know what you mean nelsong.  Until fusion 5:1:11, the power of choice remains – draw near God or forsake the divine will.  Live loyally or not.  Succumb to self-admiration or not.  When our Creator Son leaves Salvington 33:0:1 , executive power is delegated to Gabriel.  Michael’s place is assumed by Gabriel 33:2:5 when he’s away.  Gabriel is a unique and permanent being (as far as I know) in Nebadon. 

    He is a loyal chief executive of our Creator Son.

      He was created that way and he is above reproach.  We will learn more about him as we ascend.  We do not worship him.

    It seems that the rebels were clamoring for changes and reforms. They were disgruntled. Gabriel was resistant to change his methods of administration and organization. Michael chose to be aloof on the matter. I wonder exactly why. Gabriel then took decisive action.

    Why did Gabriel take action on the rebellion if Michael remained aloof?

    Would this not be considered disloyalty to Michael on the part of Gabriel?

    Why did not Gabriel also remain aloof and comply with Michael’s lead?

    #12699
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    nelsong
    Participant

    As above so below with ideas as weapons?

    i suppose that highly advanced spirit beings who tend to master the idea of mind over matter really don’t need guns as they can fabricate unimaginably destructive toys?

    you don’t paint a pretty picture of a universe that i want to ascend into

    and I have difficulty believing these highly advanced beings think like humans with human emotions

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